von Marwitz
Forum Guru
CH#165 Russian Riposte - AAR
Edit-Note:
It appears, that we have played the Flame-Throwing tanks wrong which has had a significant impact on the scenario. See the following thread on how the FT tanks should have been handled.
http://www.gamesquad.com/forums/index.php?threads/vehicular-ft-and-upper-levels.140845/
A Russian elite force with two KV8 FT-tanks and other hard to bust heavy metal enters (KV-1 M42, Lend Lease Churchhills) with Riders and Truck borne infantry. They have to capture some buildings and most importantly the "church" on board 23, which has a 3rd level Steeple in 23F3.
The at start German force consists of only 4 squads, one leader and a 50L ATG, which has not the best chances to harm the tanks. The Germans have PF capability, but their range is only 1. The most potent anti-tank asset is the German PSK. One squad equivalent plus SW/SMC may set up HIP. In turn two, the Germans receive reinforcements in the form of 2x Pz IVH and two ht's with elite 3x 548's, a HMG, DC and a 9-2 leader, which must enter as Passengers/Riders.
I had the Germans in this one. Their problem is that their at start force is slim. It is very important to attempt to hit the Russians while they are still vulnerable as Passengers/Riders. But to cover the Russian entry areas, the Germans will probably have to disperse their meagre forces somewhat and use long range fire. If the Germans are too dispersed or set up too far forward, they will be stomped piecemeal or maybe unable to fall back.
The Russians have a shorter route on the South from which they can enter and a longer one from the North and a yet longer one from the East. Due to the wet weather, a non-paved Road costs 1MF/MP to use. This does constrain the Trucks to the roads to an extent, which the Germans had better cover. While the Southern approach to the village is shorter, the northern one is somewhat safer, but will require the Russians to fight through the village. Furthermore, as the German reinforcements also enter from the North, the Russians might find themselves between the "church" and the reinforcing Germans, which is probably beneficial for the Russians.
For sure, the German at-start force can't hope to hold the village vs. the Russian attackers by themselves. The constant dilemma for the Germans is if they fire vs. the Russian infantry, the KV Flamethrower tanks will move up and roast them with 32FP at range 2 (out of PF range) or 16FP at range 3. If the few Germans instead fall back to avoid the FT-tanks (and the infantry FT...), the Russian infantry can just go forward quickly. In fact, there is pretty much nothing the German can do against those FT-tanks except to hope that they stumble close enough to the PSK. I felt like something of a spectator in this game as the Germans for quite a while, which did cut down on the fun rating.
My opponent chose the Northern approach. A German squad covering 17R4 from 23F9 2nd level cowered - such sh** just must not happen to the meagre German forces in the important opening turn, where the Russians are vulnerable. The German MMG back in the church managed to place one single RFP into S5. Even this single RFP made the Russians uneasy, but he dared it and basically managed to get his entire force close to the 17T8 area completely unharmed, turning turrets to bail out the Riders with only a single break result. A bad start for the Germans. The first German turn did not do much, because most Russians were out of LOS.
During the second Russian turn, 3 out of 4 Germa attacks cowered with 10s, and 12, so the Russian infantry waltzed forward towards the 23K9/J9 street. My opponent did get the German entry zone wrong, thinking they would enter from the South, while they entered from the North. This caused him to subobptimally place most of his tanks in the 17Z9 area. Furthermore, he should have put forces in place to interdict the 23P5 area, which would have been perfectly feasible with tanks, ATR and MG, to interdict a quick German thrust of the reinforcements towards the "church" area.
As with the comparably thin skinned German tanks and vulnerable ht's I certainly did not want to be separated by the Russians from the few Germans on the "church" side, I took the risk to careen down the street west of the canal chancing an ATR and some infantry fire to unload the ht's in 23F6 and 23G6. My plan was to Abandon the ht's on the H5/G6 and G6/F6 hexsides to prevent later bypass by the Russian FT-tanks the could threaten the "church" from there otherwise. As my two German tanks were outnumbered I did not dare to charge their thicker-skinned Russian counterparts but took cover behind the wall west of the canal. The Russians fried my squad in 23F9, a Dummy managed to retreat from originally 23O10 to 23H8. The German defensive line after German Turn 2 basically ran from 23L5&J4 (tanks), 23H5, G6, F9 (infantry), 23L7 (still HIP ATG) and 23C10 (still HIP HS+PSK).
In Russian Turn 3, they basically moved all their infantry across the J9/K9 road until the G8/H7 area. Hoping to catch a tank coming close and well aware that if I fired prematurely, the ATG would be lost, I let the infantry pass. Unfortunaely, three of the Russian tanks moved via 23G10 to F8, G9, and H9 where neither the ATG nor the PSK had any good chances to get at them. If they failed, it was sure that they would get toasted by the FTs. My ATG went down in CC after being discovered in the APh without having done anything. One of the FT-tanks was in position to threaten F6 and G6 from F8 without the Germans being able to do anything against it - it killed a HS and one of the ht's subsequently.
In German turn 3, I abandoned the F6, G6, H5 line to fall back into the church. As the Russians had captured my ATG and had an ATR in K7, my tanks moved to I2 and bypass J2 (out of FT-range) to cover my former defensive line and parts of the street separating the "church" from the attackers.
In Russian Turn 4, the tanks moved into the street next to the church with one FT-tank in D5. The Russian infantry moved into the F6, G6, H5 line and partly onto the street. Finally, the Germans were able to inflict some damage by breaking 3 Russian squads and killing a FT tank in E5. My HIP 247 in D6 failed to find a PF to get at the FT tank in D5. However, the Russian FT tanks performed well breaking Germans in the "church".
German turn 4 saw an attempt to pound the Russians a bit more with mixed success, though the German situation seemed to improve. In Russian Turn 5, the German 9-2, 548+HMG was killed by a CH of a KV in H6. This was probably the time when the game finally turned definitively in favor of the Russians. I managed to kill the second FT tank in C5 with a PF from D4, but only after it had ravaged my brokies and last leader in E3.
The Russians were storming into the church in force during their Turn 5. My sole GO 548 in F4 attempted an Infantry OVR vs. a Russian leader in the stairwell to avoid overwhelming PB fire, but due to the +3 modifier because of the stone building, he did not make it and was subsequently eliminated for FTR. One Churchill had sneaked up to K3 to shoot my tanks from behind but was itself killed in the attempt. Besides this, my tanks pounded the stairwells in an attempt to prevent the Russians from ascending.
At the start of Russian T6, I managed to rally my 8-0 and a HS, but as these were my sole remaining forces in the "church", they did succumb to overwhelming odds in the CCPh for a Russian win at the end of Russian Turn 6.
After really frustrating first three turns for the Germans, the game got a little more interesting during turns 4 and 5. But had the Russians blocked the 23P5 area to slow down my reinforcements for one more turn before they got into position, the affair would have been far more one-sided. So overall, I did not like this scenario too much as the Germans.
von Marwitz
Edit-Note:
It appears, that we have played the Flame-Throwing tanks wrong which has had a significant impact on the scenario. See the following thread on how the FT tanks should have been handled.
http://www.gamesquad.com/forums/index.php?threads/vehicular-ft-and-upper-levels.140845/
A Russian elite force with two KV8 FT-tanks and other hard to bust heavy metal enters (KV-1 M42, Lend Lease Churchhills) with Riders and Truck borne infantry. They have to capture some buildings and most importantly the "church" on board 23, which has a 3rd level Steeple in 23F3.
The at start German force consists of only 4 squads, one leader and a 50L ATG, which has not the best chances to harm the tanks. The Germans have PF capability, but their range is only 1. The most potent anti-tank asset is the German PSK. One squad equivalent plus SW/SMC may set up HIP. In turn two, the Germans receive reinforcements in the form of 2x Pz IVH and two ht's with elite 3x 548's, a HMG, DC and a 9-2 leader, which must enter as Passengers/Riders.
I had the Germans in this one. Their problem is that their at start force is slim. It is very important to attempt to hit the Russians while they are still vulnerable as Passengers/Riders. But to cover the Russian entry areas, the Germans will probably have to disperse their meagre forces somewhat and use long range fire. If the Germans are too dispersed or set up too far forward, they will be stomped piecemeal or maybe unable to fall back.
The Russians have a shorter route on the South from which they can enter and a longer one from the North and a yet longer one from the East. Due to the wet weather, a non-paved Road costs 1MF/MP to use. This does constrain the Trucks to the roads to an extent, which the Germans had better cover. While the Southern approach to the village is shorter, the northern one is somewhat safer, but will require the Russians to fight through the village. Furthermore, as the German reinforcements also enter from the North, the Russians might find themselves between the "church" and the reinforcing Germans, which is probably beneficial for the Russians.
For sure, the German at-start force can't hope to hold the village vs. the Russian attackers by themselves. The constant dilemma for the Germans is if they fire vs. the Russian infantry, the KV Flamethrower tanks will move up and roast them with 32FP at range 2 (out of PF range) or 16FP at range 3. If the few Germans instead fall back to avoid the FT-tanks (and the infantry FT...), the Russian infantry can just go forward quickly. In fact, there is pretty much nothing the German can do against those FT-tanks except to hope that they stumble close enough to the PSK. I felt like something of a spectator in this game as the Germans for quite a while, which did cut down on the fun rating.
My opponent chose the Northern approach. A German squad covering 17R4 from 23F9 2nd level cowered - such sh** just must not happen to the meagre German forces in the important opening turn, where the Russians are vulnerable. The German MMG back in the church managed to place one single RFP into S5. Even this single RFP made the Russians uneasy, but he dared it and basically managed to get his entire force close to the 17T8 area completely unharmed, turning turrets to bail out the Riders with only a single break result. A bad start for the Germans. The first German turn did not do much, because most Russians were out of LOS.
During the second Russian turn, 3 out of 4 Germa attacks cowered with 10s, and 12, so the Russian infantry waltzed forward towards the 23K9/J9 street. My opponent did get the German entry zone wrong, thinking they would enter from the South, while they entered from the North. This caused him to subobptimally place most of his tanks in the 17Z9 area. Furthermore, he should have put forces in place to interdict the 23P5 area, which would have been perfectly feasible with tanks, ATR and MG, to interdict a quick German thrust of the reinforcements towards the "church" area.
As with the comparably thin skinned German tanks and vulnerable ht's I certainly did not want to be separated by the Russians from the few Germans on the "church" side, I took the risk to careen down the street west of the canal chancing an ATR and some infantry fire to unload the ht's in 23F6 and 23G6. My plan was to Abandon the ht's on the H5/G6 and G6/F6 hexsides to prevent later bypass by the Russian FT-tanks the could threaten the "church" from there otherwise. As my two German tanks were outnumbered I did not dare to charge their thicker-skinned Russian counterparts but took cover behind the wall west of the canal. The Russians fried my squad in 23F9, a Dummy managed to retreat from originally 23O10 to 23H8. The German defensive line after German Turn 2 basically ran from 23L5&J4 (tanks), 23H5, G6, F9 (infantry), 23L7 (still HIP ATG) and 23C10 (still HIP HS+PSK).
In Russian Turn 3, they basically moved all their infantry across the J9/K9 road until the G8/H7 area. Hoping to catch a tank coming close and well aware that if I fired prematurely, the ATG would be lost, I let the infantry pass. Unfortunaely, three of the Russian tanks moved via 23G10 to F8, G9, and H9 where neither the ATG nor the PSK had any good chances to get at them. If they failed, it was sure that they would get toasted by the FTs. My ATG went down in CC after being discovered in the APh without having done anything. One of the FT-tanks was in position to threaten F6 and G6 from F8 without the Germans being able to do anything against it - it killed a HS and one of the ht's subsequently.
In German turn 3, I abandoned the F6, G6, H5 line to fall back into the church. As the Russians had captured my ATG and had an ATR in K7, my tanks moved to I2 and bypass J2 (out of FT-range) to cover my former defensive line and parts of the street separating the "church" from the attackers.
In Russian Turn 4, the tanks moved into the street next to the church with one FT-tank in D5. The Russian infantry moved into the F6, G6, H5 line and partly onto the street. Finally, the Germans were able to inflict some damage by breaking 3 Russian squads and killing a FT tank in E5. My HIP 247 in D6 failed to find a PF to get at the FT tank in D5. However, the Russian FT tanks performed well breaking Germans in the "church".
German turn 4 saw an attempt to pound the Russians a bit more with mixed success, though the German situation seemed to improve. In Russian Turn 5, the German 9-2, 548+HMG was killed by a CH of a KV in H6. This was probably the time when the game finally turned definitively in favor of the Russians. I managed to kill the second FT tank in C5 with a PF from D4, but only after it had ravaged my brokies and last leader in E3.
The Russians were storming into the church in force during their Turn 5. My sole GO 548 in F4 attempted an Infantry OVR vs. a Russian leader in the stairwell to avoid overwhelming PB fire, but due to the +3 modifier because of the stone building, he did not make it and was subsequently eliminated for FTR. One Churchill had sneaked up to K3 to shoot my tanks from behind but was itself killed in the attempt. Besides this, my tanks pounded the stairwells in an attempt to prevent the Russians from ascending.
At the start of Russian T6, I managed to rally my 8-0 and a HS, but as these were my sole remaining forces in the "church", they did succumb to overwhelming odds in the CCPh for a Russian win at the end of Russian Turn 6.
After really frustrating first three turns for the Germans, the game got a little more interesting during turns 4 and 5. But had the Russians blocked the 23P5 area to slow down my reinforcements for one more turn before they got into position, the affair would have been far more one-sided. So overall, I did not like this scenario too much as the Germans.
von Marwitz
Last edited:
