CC question: Capturing

Tuomo

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This almost came up in a game yesterday, but I think we karmically veered away from the potential rules question.

Say a conscript 436 squad and a 9-1 leader are in CC with an enemy 458. The Russian attack will happen at 1-2 (no HtH), but what happens if they want to make a Capture attempt? I guess by A20.22, the CC DRM vs the 436 is -1 but is +1 vs the 9-1.

So, what happens with various Russian CC DRs:
DR = 2: Everybody captured, plus Leader Creation and possible Infiltration for the Russians
DR = 3: The 436 is Captured (final DR = 2) and so is the 9-1 since the final DR against him would be a 4, which would normally be Random Selection on the 1-2 CC column but sincehe's the only one this final DR would apply to, it automatically selects him?
DR = 4: The 436 is Captured (final DR = 3), but the 9-1 is OK (final DR of 5 is a miss)
DR = 5: A 236 HS is Captured (final DR = 4 that only applies to the 436, not the 9-1) and the 9-1 is OK
DR = 6+ Both 436 and 9-1 are OK

Is that right?
 

jrv

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Sounds correct to me.

Note that capturing a 236 is not so good for the 458, as it ends up with escaping prisoners because the prisoners are in Melee.

JR
 

Tuomo

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I think you mean "prisoners who are eligible to roll for Escape".

If I were the 458 and captured a HS, I'd immediately Deploy. That way if the prisoners revolt, they'd only be tying up one of my units.
 

jrv

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I think you mean "prisoners who are eligible to roll for Escape".

If I were the 458 and captured a HS, I'd immediately Deploy. That way if the prisoners revolt, they'd only be tying up one of my units.
No, I mean they are escaping. Prisoners are eligible for escape if they are held by a broken guard. They must pass a NTC to start escaping. Prisoners in a Melee do not have to take a NTC. There is a question about the exact timing when an outside attack intervenes, but if there is no outside attack in the next CCPh there will be a prisoner, a 236 and a 9-1. If the Soviets deploy, the prisoners can attack their guard (first and non-simultaneous) at 1:2 alone or 2:1 -1 with the 236 and 9-1. They could also attack both the guard and the non-guard (again first and non-simultaneous) at 1:1 -1. I think deploy is probably a bad idea for the Soviets. That forces a 1:1 -1 attack, while the guard could attack the prisoners only at 4:1. Still that will leave them in Melee for another turn.

JR
 

jrv

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As a follow-on, if the Soviets deploy and the prisoners, the 236 plus the 9-1 attack and eliminate the guard at 2:1, the prisoners will immediately re-arm. The remaining Soviet 248 now faces two 236s plus the 9-1.

JR
 

Tuomo

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Geez. Thanks, JR. One of those subtleties that looks like it could bite one in the tuckus.

So the lesson is, if you're going to try to capture someone, don't leave the job half-done.
 

Gordon

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So the lesson is, if you're going to try to capture someone, don't leave the job half-done.
Words to live by in ASL or in one's side gig for the mob.
 

jrv

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So the lesson is, if you're going to try to capture someone, don't leave the job half-done.
In the broader picture, try to avoid having prisoners in CC. Don't bring them into CC. Try to avoid situations where you might end up capturing part but not all of a force. These are only rules-of-thumb, and they can be broken if the circumstances are appropriate, e.g. if the odds in favor are overwhelming or you are desperate enough, but in general you should not mix prisoners and CC.

JR
 
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