BFP 3 Discussion Points

[rdw5150]

I have taken a different approach. I have HTML'd all my core rules.

tease:nuts::clown::smoke:

one day I'll have an HTML of the rules, one day. Hopefully through offical means. I have a V1 in HTML, and that works fine and all, but I have hankering for HTML of RBV2.

As for as trimming down I started making photocopies of my "to play" list. That way at ASLOK, I can just hand the packet to the person and say "this is my list".

I was not going to take my scenario binders to ASLOK last year because I had my list packet, but deciced to take at least the ones with the "offical" stuff in it. I was glad I did as quite a few people needed a hand with scenarios. I figure since I do not drive from far away, I can load up on stuff in case people need it.

Peace

Roger

 

[RobZagnut]

I commented before on the DW board issue. A definite yes, the only limit is imagination.

A double-wide valley (level -1) would be slick. Anything in the dessert would get me to dive back into chapter F, especially if dessert was given the BFP treatment.

Though some have a lack of enthusiasm over the aircraft counters, I give them a hearty YES. I like the contrast between the almost impotent 30's FB to the Dalek like 45 FB.

I think ASL has pretty much reached the point of no return on aircraft counters. My thoughts is that many ASLers treat air support like OBA... they see it on a scenario card and flip to the next page.

Counters:
Various fire(d) counters: excellent idea, repeat when counter space allows.
Dug in: Good idea, should have enough now.
No ?ammo?: again excellent, repeat when counter space allows.

One alternative is that given that for most guns/vehicles the limited ammo only will give a few shots is to use "ammo" rather than "no ammo". This would have the advantage that counters come off rather than add to the pile. Just a thought, but I am damn glad to see the "no ammo" counters.

If there's going to be so many new status counters for guns and vehicles there needs to be a generic off-map info sheet, so all the info counters don't clutter up the board. One that is similar to the AFV cards in DASL, but could be used for 2-20 vehicles and/or guns, but just for status markers.

To keep down counter clutter I've gotten to the point of not placing Prep Fire markers during the AFPh or Final Fire during the DFFPh, instead just remembering what units fired. So, for me in most instances I'm not looking for more info counters, but ways to use less.

With this in mind after playing ASL for almost 20 years I would rather spend my time playing ASL rather than spending it on minor (sometimes irritating) time wasters. I've come up with a DON'T list of things I don't want to do before I play ASL. If I have to do those things I move on to another scenario where I don't have to do these things. My DON'T list:

I don't want to...

* have to read a bunch of extra rules before I play. See ToT's Walking Wounded rules. I still haven't played a single scenario from that pack. I did a Panji scenario once.

This makes it harder for me to come back and play HASL scenarios with a bunch of Historical SSRs. We might play them a lot when the HASL first comes out and the SSRs are fresh in my mind, but later if I have to read thru a whole page of Historcal SSRs just to play one scenario, it's usually not worth it and I find something else to play.

* place a lot of overlays. More than 3 overlays and I'm gone.
* buy and place Fortifications, unless I know ahead of time I'm the defender and have time to prepare a defense. Cave Complexes are no longer in my future.
* wait over 30 minutes for my opponent to setup a defense (see above).
* look thru too many vehicle notes, 3-4 'unusual' vehicles are okay, but I reach critical mass if I see a scenario with 8-10 weird vehicles where I'm going to have pull out the vehicle notes on every one and do a research paper before I play. The scenario Funnies at Zfleck (sp?) will never see time on my table.

I do use HoB's Halftrack Notes all the time. It's the info card that came out of an issue of Recon By Fire that shows you what MGs you can pull out of Halftracks. THAT is a time saver and a great resource. I would love to see more of this type of info sheet.

 

[mgmasl]

Received 1 week ago.

New double wide boards are a great new concept opening a lot of new posibilities.
I like the counters even aircraft ones if they add a new aircraft type.

I like specially the near miss rule for heavy rockets -hitting as Area if failed for TEM#- I think this is a missed rule for big guns in ASL.
I´ve enjoyed reading every article.

No time yet to play any scenario, but a lot of them in my wish list.

I really hope new products of this superb quality.

Thx a lot for so great effort
Miguel

 

[Steve E7]

I just finished setting up my defense for BFP64, Fighting with the Devil. Extensive use of the BFP Dense Jungle counters. I wasn't sure I was going to like them, but wow did I like the effect!
This scenario has board 2 in play, and the use of 14 of these .. well you can imagine how different the feel of that board is using the dense jungle counters. Not the Hill 621 you grew up with!
Now, I'm using VASL, and actually used the palm tree draggable overlays to do this, changed color with the level, and it looks good. I didn't pull the actual counters in the extension, for this.
I'm not sure how I'd feel with 14 5/8" counters about the map in a ftf game, in what is already a pretty heavy density counter oob.
So, is the idea a super one? I'd say definitely yes, I like it. Would I like transparent overlays instead? Yes, probably.
Steve Etz

 

[Matt Book]

I have two ideas for info counters:

1. How about counters denoting that the MG's on AFV, especially half-tracks, have been removed or abandoned? That way when your passenger takes the .50 cal off you know you still have the .30 on board. Something like= SA Removed or Passenger MG NA/Removed.

2. Remember how much everyone liked the HOB Beserk counters. How about Heroic leader counters so that you don't have to carry around that extra heroic counter on your leader? Make them a neutral color so they could apply to all nationalities.

 

[Matt Book]

How about a CG for Anzio or Salerno where the Germans win by smahing the beachhead?

 

[skye88]

-DW Map concept.

Cool, keep it up.

-Ground Attack Aircraft

Mwoah....

-Terrain Counters

Hmmm, not convinced. Rather use overlays , less messy on the board.

It's a great product. I'd put in a bit more small scenario's though next time.

 

[Aaron Cleavin]

Have finished 4 B&J scenarios so far with a 5th almost finished. Impressions so far.

BFP30 Chinese Alamo: At first glance a fascinating situation and certainly lots of toys on both sides. The defensive options for the Chinese seem fairly limited though perhaps
limiting replayability. While I think the Japanese have the edge the Chinese certainly have some good firepower and neat defensive tricks (Set DC, Fort, Wire, HMG). Key are
the Japanese MTR SMOKE and the OBA if these do well then life may be tough for the Chinese. (6.5/10)

BFP52 Kachin Surpise: The Kachin are way way cool. They are not however enough to make this much fun for the Americans. Too many defensive tricks and delaying tactics
the Japanese can use to eat the clock in this. One SSR most surely needed is to ban the use of HIP THH for the Japanese. In fact I would like a rule outlawing their use by
default if the opposition has no tanks. With these banned and one more turn for the Americans I think the scenario works (BTW I took the Japanese in this) (7/10)

BFP30: Melee near the coast: Super awesome, lots of options for both sides and tough tactical choices. Right up there with the best of all infantry Small-Medium (but still tournieable) PTO scenarios.
(9.5/10)

BFP 56: White Beach 1: A lovely small sized Beach assault. Lots of Marine toys but the Japanese hard to crack. My Japanese could do no wrong and diced the Marines like sashimi, but I could easily see
it going the other way. Caves without a Cave complex makes it very accessible. And it's small size makes the NOBA quite playable as well. (8.5/10)

BFP27 Chaipei Roadblock: In the final phases of this and again a really fabulous design. Lots of cool stuff for both sides to do. The trenches connecting to buildings for the defender makes all the difference.
The heterogeneous AFV makes it a real coordination issue for the Japanese. If the Japanese lose and have more than a third of their OB survive they simply haven't been agressive enough.
Daryl Lundy has passed a number of severe PMC's in the face of some outrageous dice, and the scenario will go down to the Wire. (9/10)

So from 5 Scenarios an average rating of just over 8/10. Damm Fine!

Plus I think with a few small tweaks Kachin Surprise could also be a classic.

 

[micky]

BFP 56: White Beach 1: A lovely small sized Beach assault. Lots of Marine toys but the Japanese hard to crack. My Japanese could do no wrong and diced the Marines like sashimi, but I could easily see
it going the other way. Caves without a Cave complex makes it very accessible. And it's small size makes the NOBA quite playable as well. (8.5/10)

I've been looking that particular scnenario over, while waiting for CoB and GH to arrive in the mail and trying to decide which B&J scenarios to play first. (FINALLY!!) I might make that my first scenario to play, when I get to trying to learn Beach assaults.

 

[Chas]

Aaron,

Great post, thank you. Some comments.

Chinese Alamo. There may be more than you realize, but it does have "Alamo" in the title, so essentially every game does eventually come down to fighting over that building.

Kachin Rangers. Something about your post has me confused. If I screwed something up on this one I have no problem issuing an errata or whatever is necessary. Per your comment on the THH, this could/would then apply to nearly every all infantry scenario with the Japanese. I believe what you are possibly misplaying are that THH do not Control anything. They provide a bit of a CC headache if a unit unwittingly advances in or ends move in same hex. If found by searching, the Allied player could simply not move in and the THH goes away at end of player turn. These situations, however, are ubiquitous to any action with Japanese defending. Although a small sampling, also note that ROAR currently has this at 4-4

Melee Near the Coast. Your comment here is very telling as to perceptions, possibly my misperceptions of scenarios. The use of the term "medium" scenario blows me away, but indicates where I am off the mark on some things. To me this is a small tournament scenario. When I playtested this loooooong ago, Pierce Mason came to my house. We set up at about 1700, played, switched sides, and had two games completed by midnight. So including setup we avered 3.5 hours per playing. Aaron, this is not a knock against you, but against me in that what I believe to be a tournament scenario is not to many others.

Thank you for the comments. Since you liked Melee Near the Coast, I highly recommend you give Hundred Regiments Offensive a try. My impression was that this would become the tourny type favorite action.

Thanks much,
Chas

 

[Aaron Cleavin]

Kachin Rangers. Something about your post has me confused. If I screwed something up on this one I have no problem issuing an errata or whatever is necessary. Per your comment on the THH, this could/would then apply to nearly every all infantry scenario with the Japanese. I believe what you are possibly misplaying are that THH do not Control anything. They provide a bit of a CC headache if a unit unwittingly advances in or ends move in same hex. If found by searching, the Allied player could simply not move in and the THH goes away at end of player turn. These situations, however, are ubiquitous to any action with Japanese defending. Although a small sampling, also note that ROAR currently has this at 4-4

I think this does apply to most late war all Infantry scenarios vs Japanese the 3 HIP THH Heros are probably worth about a Squad of American all up mainly because of the Ambush possibilities. The fear factor though reduces speed and these combined are worth a nice little edge for the Japanese. Also voluntary breaking whole Japanese squads is not something done often enough but in this scenario will add to survivability and fall back effectiveness if done once or twice. The THH + the close terrain and the distance to traverse mean I think the Americans have a little too much to do. I will try again though taking the Americans to see what I can do with it. Fallback multiline defense for Japanese is an under utilized and appreciated art which might not have fully come out in a playtest.

Melee Near the Coast. Your comment here is very telling as to perceptions, possibly my misperceptions of scenarios. The use of the term "medium" scenario blows me away, but indicates where I am off the mark on some things. To me this is a small tournament scenario. When I playtested this loooooong ago, Pierce Mason came to my house. We set up at about 1700, played, switched sides, and had two games completed by midnight. So including setup we avered 3.5 hours per playing. Aaron, this is not a knock against you, but against me in that what I believe to be a tournament scenario is not to many others.

I think I could whip thru Melee Near the Coast in 4 hours when I had my PTO game on against a like minded opponent. For many though I think 5 hours might be closer whuch means it is at the edge of tournie playable especially with 13.5 + 3 on T3 Attacking Squads and 14.5 + 4 on T4 defending squads involved. I have it as a tournie offering next month but will probably make sure the players picking it involved are grognards at fast efficent PTO play.
(Also I played it via VASL which does add at least 30% to play time even with Skype, I played vs Bob Wilson VASL/Skype, Bob is a fast player and we took I think 6 Skype hours before Bob conceded in the middle of the 6th)

I finished Chaipei Chockblock the other night. A Chinese Crew had a 12 rolled versus it in CC, withdrew and ran like buggery to take back one of the buildings having to break and run upstairs to another building hex for the win. The Japanese 10-1 BH's to a Heroic 10-2, there were 85% Chinese Casulties and 75% Japanese Casulties: a wonderful Bloodbath!!!

 

[Chas]

Aaron,

Very glad to hear that you liked Chaipei. Have you been posting your results to ROAR?

Thanks much,
Chas

 

[Aaron Cleavin]

Aaron,

Very glad to hear that you liked Chaipei. Have you been posting your results to ROAR?

Thanks much,
Chas

Should just be finishing my 7th playing of a B&J scenario tomorrow then I will post all to ROAR along with 41 other games (48th Game of the year completed!)

Tomorrow's game is a second playing of Kachin Rangers which may give me a more complete impression of same

 

[Aaron Cleavin]

Should just be finishing my 7th playing of a B&J scenario tomorrow then I will post all to ROAR along with 41 other games (48th Game of the year completed!)

Tomorrow's game is a second playing of Kachin Rangers which may give me a more complete impression of same

Finished Kachin Rangers again this time as the Americans/Kachin

And the result was......

A blowout win to the Americans!

So it must be a dog if I thrashed the opposition both ways...

Seriously I think for an all infantry scenario it is highly technical and demanding of both players.

The Kachin capabilities need to be maximized and the Japanese need to use all of the tricks in their bag.

If I was playing for kidneys I'd take the Japanese but the Americans/Kachin have good leadership are stealthy, and the Kachin 1.5 MF in woods is a BIG deal going uphill into CC.

I would call it 55% pro Japanese but reducing their force at all would make them too brittle.

Banning the HIP THH I would maintain as being good thing and probably would bring it back to even.

 

[RobZagnut]

I played this recently and won as the Japanese, but it was really close. The U.S. player fell into 3 of my 4 HIP half-squad traps and lost 2 squads and a leader in CC. I agree that reducing the Japanese would make them too brittle. I would play either side.

 

[Chas]

Indications are that Kachin Rangers is playing out pretty close overall. Interesting to see how this will play out at some tournaments.

Chas