Beserk chargers roll for ambush?

76mm

Member
Silver Supporting Member
Joined
Feb 13, 2012
Messages
106
Reaction score
30
Location
DC
Country
llUnited States
I've just had a beserk squad move into an enemy occupied hex, but it is not clear whether they should roll for ambush... Rule A11.4 says "Whenever Infantry advance into CC (unless reinforcing a Melee) in a woods/building Location or with/against a concealed unit(s) an Ambush can conceivably occur, " (emphasis added) but my beserk unit did not "advance into CC"--it moved into it...

However, Rule A15.432 says that "Berserk units are always Lax (11.18) in CC." According to A11.18, the only effect (in CC) of being Lax is a +1 drm to the Ambush status dr.

Is it fair to assume that beserk units should roll for Ambush?
 

Swiftandsure

Robin Reeve
Silver Supporting Member
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
Messages
16,456
Reaction score
2,019
Location
St-Légier
First name
Robin
Country
llSwitzerland
If another unit has advanced in the Location, an ambush can occur* and the Berserk lax status kicks in.
If it is the Berserker's opponent's turn, a unit may have advanced in the Berserker's Location, with a possibility* of ambush too.

* if the other conditions of an ambush possibility are met, of course.
 

76mm

Member
Silver Supporting Member
Joined
Feb 13, 2012
Messages
106
Reaction score
30
Location
DC
Country
llUnited States
Thanks for the explanation...
 

Vinnie

See Dummies in the index
Joined
Feb 9, 2005
Messages
16,019
Reaction score
1,841
Location
Aberdeen , Scotland
Country
llUnited Kingdom
I've risked the berserk and lax modifiers to the ambush when I've had a leader go berserk and charge in. Better to risk the ambush than the 4:1 attack.
 

76mm

Member
Silver Supporting Member
Joined
Feb 13, 2012
Messages
106
Reaction score
30
Location
DC
Country
llUnited States
I've risked the berserk and lax modifiers to the ambush when I've had a leader go berserk and charge in. Better to risk the ambush than the 4:1 attack.
Sorry if I'm being a bit thick here, but you lost me here...I thought that if a beserk leader charged in there would not be an ambush dr because he is not advancing into the hex?
 

zgrose

Elder Member
Joined
Jun 13, 2004
Messages
3,583
Reaction score
531
Location
Kingwood, TX
First name
Zoltan
Country
llUnited States
Sorry if I'm being a bit thick here, but you lost me here...I thought that if a beserk leader charged in there would not be an ambush dr because he is not advancing into the hex?
If someone else advances in before the Melee exists, the Ambush dr will happen in the CCPh.
 

Jazz

Inactive
Staff member
Moderator
Joined
Feb 3, 2003
Messages
10,565
Reaction score
1,026
Country
llLithuania
Sorry if I'm being a bit thick here, but you lost me here...I thought that if a beserk leader charged in there would not be an ambush dr because he is not advancing into the hex?
If the 'zerker moves in and nobody follows: No ambush.

If the 'zerker moves in AND there is a non-'zerk unit that does advance in after him, then you're back to ambush situation, with all the attendant Lax/'zerk penalties.
 

jrv

Forum Guru
Joined
May 25, 2005
Messages
21,123
Reaction score
5,257
Location
Teutoburger Wald
Country
llIceland
If the 'zerker moves in and nobody follows: No ambush.
If berserker charges and nobody advances and there is no concealed unit that can retain concealment in the hex, then no ambush. Sometimes a concealed unit might be able to retain concealment despite A8.312 mandatory TPBF, e.g. if G.4 applies. In that case an ambush will occur despite no one advancing in. There are other odd circumstances that can result in ambush. For the situation the OP had in mind, there was probably no ambush.

JR
 

Vinnie

See Dummies in the index
Joined
Feb 9, 2005
Messages
16,019
Reaction score
1,841
Location
Aberdeen , Scotland
Country
llUnited Kingdom
In my instance I had A 9-2 go berserk and charge forwards with a squad. The squad died but the 9-2 made it into a building with a 467 sitting there.
Follow up troops arrived to support. If I left the 9-2 there by himself he was almost certainly dead. By advancing another unit in, I created the ambush situation, advancing troops into a building.
Of course I am then lax and berserk so get a +2 on the ambush roll.
 

jrv

Forum Guru
Joined
May 25, 2005
Messages
21,123
Reaction score
5,257
Location
Teutoburger Wald
Country
llIceland
In my instance I had A 9-2 go berserk and charge forwards with a squad. The squad died but the 9-2 made it into a building with a 467 sitting there.
Follow up troops arrived to support. If I left the 9-2 there by himself he was almost certainly dead. By advancing another unit in, I created the ambush situation, advancing troops into a building.
Of course I am then lax and berserk so get a +2 on the ambush roll.
Potentially saving a 9-2 is certainly worth considering the risk of ambush with a berserk unit, especially if you go from 4:1 odds against to 1:2 odds by advancing in at least a matching four FP squad. Of course it would depend. If the berserk 9-2 just ran out of the final VC building on the next-to-last turn, you might just wish him well in his future endeavors.

JR
 
Last edited:

76mm

Member
Silver Supporting Member
Joined
Feb 13, 2012
Messages
106
Reaction score
30
Location
DC
Country
llUnited States
Great, thanks for the detailed responses...don't think I'd have figured that out on my own.
 
Top