Baseball Thread, 2011

[Blaze]

All this from a man that built his sand castle and painted it red along the banks of the Allegheny River.....

Oh well....

One correction, the CUBS haven't won the World Series in almost 100 years, so quit complaining about your Bucs not having one the Series since the "Age of Disco"..... (I always hated that stupid song anyways).....

Yes but, have the Cubs had 18 straight losing seasons? A feat no professional team in any American sport has done.

I'm not complaining at all about a World Seres. The way baseball is messed up, a small market team like the Bucs has only a fluke chance of seeing a world series. God Almighty... The Yankee's Tailor was just here getting Andrew McCutchen and Joel Hanrahan fitted for pinstripes.

You know you're a Sister Sledge closeted fan! But yeah, I did hate that song along with those silly Pillbox hats of the late 70's.

 

[MajorDomo]

The Cubs all time record is 8215 wins and 8049 losses through 2005; which is ahead of many of the teams mentioned in this thread. Their futility at snatching a World Series is legendary and leads to the view that they always lose.

I believe that Ossie Guillen is actually a very good game manager, actually better than Leyland, who occasionally makes questionable moves based upon hunches.

Kenny Williams is a "with me or against me guy", but I was amazed earlier this week when he said - Ozzie should play the players he sees as the best to win that day, I don't care how much their salaries are, if I made a signing mistake, so be it.

The problem for the Tigers is that they are below .500 the last three years if you omit the games that Verlander starts.

With the division's best run team, the Twins in an injury year tailspin, the Indians have a chance. They are younger and more athletic, good plusses as the long season grinds towards September.

Rich

 

[Rockford]

The Phillies just stole Hunter Pence from Houston for a couple of hats and a player to be named later. It's going to come down to Phils or Giants again this year, I think. NL winner takes it.

 

[Bret Hildebran]

I'm not complaining at all about a World Seres. The way baseball is messed up, a small market team like the Bucs has only a fluke chance of seeing a world series.

I'm not sure how fair that is. Of the last 10 World Series Champs, baseball has 9 different winners (that compares very favorably to any other sport) and at least 3 of those are certainly not big market teams (STL, FLA & ARI) and another two champs from big cities, but the secondary team in each market in the White Sox & Angels. At most I'd say only 5 champs in the last 10 years come from truly "Big Market" franchises (BOS twice, NYY, SF & PHI).

And all those but the Yankees had a legacy of not winning it all prior their recent WS success. Boston was a 1918 punchline akin to the Cubs, San Fran had never won it all on the West Coast (last title '54) & Philly had the lone WS title in 1980 in franchise history. Big markets, but no ring success until recently...

If the Bucs are managed competently, there's no reason they can't compete. But frankly they haven't had competent ownership in over a decade and that shows in their performance on the field...

 

[wrongway149]

If the Bucs are managed competently, there's no reason they can't compete. But frankly they haven't had competent ownership in over a decade and that shows in their performance on the field...

So, is it just a young team maturing together at the right time (like the '07 Tribe)?

I guess we have to get off Dolan's case now- He let Antonetti make some trades as a buyer this deadline. We win more division games thane we lose the rest of the way and we'll likely take theAL Central.

Not seeing getting past the first round of the playoffs in any case, but I'd still like to finish strong.

 

[kynken]

The Phillies just stole Hunter Pence from Houston for a couple of hats and a player to be named later. It's going to come down to Phils or Giants again this year, I think. NL winner takes it.

Being born and raised in the city, I have to take my San Francisco Giants. We are a hidden snake and just took 2 out of 3 in Philly.

 

[Kevin Kenneally]

Being born and raised in the city, I have to take my San Francisco Giants. We are a hidden snake and just took 2 out of 3 in Philly.

Might root for them IF the Red Sox don't make it to the WS.

My father was able to watch the Giants play the Dodgers in NY during the early 1950s as a soldier stationed at Fort Hamilton (.25 cents for a ticket).

 

[Kevin Kenneally]

Red Sox and Indians are playing on ESPN Monday night baseball.

Someone call Pete Shelling and let him know they're playing.

I don't care who wins, but the beer tastes GREAT with the peanuts and popcorn (all provided as 'complimentary' at the Comfort Suites Hotel in Ogden Utah). :clown:

 

[Kevin Kenneally]

Red Sox and Indians are playing on ESPN Monday night baseball.

Someone call Pete Shelling and let him know they're playing.

I don't care who wins, but the beer tastes GREAT with the peanuts and popcorn (all provided as 'complimentary' at the Comfort Suites Hotel in Ogden Utah). :clown:

Did ANYONE contact Pete?

GREAT game.

Scoring by BOTH teams and "further reviews" by the "evil ones".....

 

[Bret Hildebran]

So, is it just a young team maturing together at the right time (like the '07 Tribe)?

Nah - nothing like that. The '07 Indians won 96 games & had a lot of talent. This year's Pirates are on pace to win 82 (FRU) - it's more an average team, playing a little lucky & being in a sucky division which is keeping them in the race (similar to this year's Indians). But overall they're not a good team and are still a few years out, but they're finally building something positive in Pittsburgh at least. They may not end the losing streak this year, but given their foundation, they'll do it in the next 3 to 5 years it would seem.

I guess we have to get off Dolan's case now- He let Antonetti make some trades as a buyer this deadline. We win more division games thane we lose the rest of the way and we'll likely take theAL Central.

Not seeing getting past the first round of the playoffs in any case, but I'd still like to finish strong.

I'm not happy they traded Drew Pomeranz - he was rolling thru AA in his first professional year. While Ubaldo is young and relatively cheap for the next few years, you controlled Pomeranz for the next 6 and he could be special. I didn't mind the Fukodome deal, but given where the Indians are this year (1 game over .500, 2.5 games back of a better team & only up 1.5 on CHI, and -12 in run differential, your 2 best OFs on the DL), I think you play for next year and not this one & you certainly don't mortgage the future at all. Be happy if you can stay near .500 this year and try to make a run next year. Adding Fukodome is fine as you effectively gave up nothing but a little cash, but Ubaldo cost you your last 2 #1 picks, one of them the 5 pick who was rapidly emerging as one of the best pitching prospects in baseball.

As loathsome as the Cliff Lee & Victor Martinez salary dumps were in '09, this move may be as dumb given where the team is today, particularly if Ubaldo doesn't pitch like an ace, which he hasn't done since the first half of last year really...

Executive summary - I'm still pissed at Dolan - although for different reasons this time, although if they sneak into the playoffs somehow, all is forgiven...

 

[rdw5150]

Nah - nothing like that. The '07 Indians won 96 games & had a lot of talent. This year's Pirates are on pace to win 82 (FRU) - it's more an average team, playing a little lucky & being in a sucky division which is keeping them in the race (similar to this year's Indians). But overall they're not a good team and are still a few years out, but they're finally building something positive in Pittsburgh at least. They may not end the losing streak this year, but given their foundation, they'll do it in the next 3 to 5 years it would seem....

If it takes another 3-5 years for them to break 81 wins, then something drastic needs to be done. 20-25 years of not even a .500 record is an embarrassment to MLB and not good for the league.

Peace

roger

 

[Bret Hildebran]

If it takes another 3-5 years for them to break 81 wins, then something drastic needs to be done. 20-25 years of not even a .500 record is an embarrassment to MLB and not good for the league.

They may get .500 this year, but I don't think it's a mortal lock by any stretch given they're a game over now & likely are a .500 team.

I agree it's embarrassing, but I'm not sure what the league can do about poorly run teams. And for PIT it often hasn't been refusing to spend, it's been spending STUPID - like signing a 30 year old Pat Meares and paying him ~$15M for 3 years of suckitude or paying a 31 year old Kevin Young $5M+ to be the worst 1B in the majors for 4 straight years. Both choices spent money poorly on bad players & clogged positions they could have upgraded by going young and then they didn't spend money on young players that actually didn't suck and let them leave town.

Maybe they can give ownership a baseball IQ test before allowing the purchase to go through? Short of that, I'm not sure what can easily be done...

 

[rdw5150]

I'm not happy they traded Drew Pomeranz - he was rolling thru AA in his first professional year. While Ubaldo is young and relatively cheap for the next few years, you controlled Pomeranz for the next 6 and he could be special. I didn't mind the Fukodome deal, but given where the Indians are this year (1 game over .500, 2.5 games back of a better team & only up 1.5 on CHI, and -12 in run differential, your 2 best OFs on the DL), I think you play for next year and not this one & you certainly don't mortgage the future at all. Be happy if you can stay near .500 this year and try to make a run next year. Adding Fukodome is fine as you effectively gave up nothing but a little cash, but Ubaldo cost you your last 2 #1 picks, one of them the 5 pick who was rapidly emerging as one of the best pitching prospects in baseball.

As loathsome as the Cliff Lee & Victor Martinez salary dumps were in '09, this move may be as dumb given where the team is today, particularly if Ubaldo doesn't pitch like an ace, which he hasn't done since the first half of last year really...

Executive summary - I'm still pissed at Dolan - although for different reasons this time, although if they sneak into the playoffs somehow, all is forgiven...

Agreed it was a bad trade. One has to ask themselves why a team would be willing to trade their "ace" who is 12 months removed from a 15-1 start and is costing them very little in salary (4 million). Something smelly is afoot. Was he not that good to begin with, is his arm tired, is he bad in the clubhouse, did they find a sucker etc. etc. etc.

We risked the farm for a run this year when quite frankly we do not have the horses. I do not care how bad the Division is, the Tribe is, at best, a .500 ball-club this year. 2012-2013 was going to be another story, but, now we have another pitcher with a loosing record and an ERA over 4, giving away our stuff pitching prospect in the process.

I have been pretty happy with the Tribe (and Pirate) season this year. I feel that more or less, they are playing better than I thought either team would and I like what I see for the future. But that is the key phrase, for the future. Neither team is ready this year, that is just reality.

Peace

Roger

 

[Psycho]

Tony LaRussa is like a creaky old house: whiny, dusty, and covered with shingles.

 

[kynken]

The Phillies just stole Hunter Pence from Houston for a couple of hats and a player to be named later. It's going to come down to Phils or Giants again this year, I think. NL winner takes it.

Well we took 2 out of 3 in Philly last week and get a crucial 4 game series here in San Francisco. Yep, I D B a giants fan. We love the style of baseball played here.

 

[Glennbo]

Pretty good week so far for my Tigers. Four game lead as of now. Out new pitcher Fister pitched well against Texas tonight, and we seem to be getting a lot of clutch hitting.

The whole thing with the Gay Angels and Jared Weaver throwing a beanball and cursing out our veteran players for not "running properly" on their home runs makes me now hate the Angels more than ever. I hope they all die. Then we'll see if they're "angels" or not. I'm proud of Gullien for skipping around the baseline right in front of that baby. I hope every team that faces him does it too 'cause he obviously isn't mature enough to cope. Mr. big, important pitcher who should be respected!

When a pitcher beans a batter, the batter ought to throw the bat at him! Anyway Jared can eat at Subway during his six game suspension, they can name a sub the "Bean Baby" after him, and the Gay Angels can go down on the Rangers and lose the division!

Looking forward to the two series against Cleveland coming up. Our manager Leyland should be able to use Verlander twice against them if he times it right. But he has a tendency to want to "rest" guys. He rested Johnny Peralta for two games for no good reason right when he's in the middle of a tear-it-up hitting streak, and he just might give Verlander an extra day off in which case he'll only face Cleveland once. Now is the time to bury Cleveland! Burn out every player on the team if we have to!

Two things that really bug me about modern baseball. "Resting" guys who aren't injured. But worst of all is this "Defensive Indifference" crap that let's guys take second base without even trying to stop them. Never used to be any Defensive Indifference when I was a kid watching the '68 Tigers. Nowadays the guy who gets second for free comes home on a single, and the next thing you know there's a walk and the next the batter is the tying run and he homers. It's B.S.!:icon_bs:

Anyway it would be nice if the Yankees choked and Cleveland got in as the Wild Card. That would make ASLOK interesting! :bigfire:

 

[Glennbo]

Well we took 2 out of 3 in Philly last week and get a crucial 4 game series here in San Francisco. Yep, I D B a giants fan. We love the style of baseball played here.

I like the Giants, and admire how well they've done after dumping BB Steroid. Trouble is, I like the Diamondbacks better. Gotta root for manager Kirk Gibson, a big hero to Detroit.

The Giants did make a nice acquisition at the trade deadline. As did Cleveland. :thumup:

 

[Glennbo]

Agreed it was a bad trade. One has to ask themselves why a team would be willing to trade their "ace" who is 12 months removed from a 15-1 start and is costing them very little in salary (4 million). Something smelly is afoot. Was he not that good to begin with, is his arm tired, is he bad in the clubhouse, did they find a sucker etc. etc. etc.... but, now we have another pitcher with a loosing record and an ERA over 4, giving away our stuff pitching prospect in the process.

"Prospects" are overrated. Give me an estblished veteran any day.

The Tigers traded away a lot of so-called "great" prospects the past few years to get good ML players, and the ML players have generally done well while the prospects haven't panned out at all for the teams we gave them to. I think the suckers are the teams that trade for prospects.

However the Tigers did get taken when they traded for Washburn...it turned out his arm wasn't right and he washed out! Same with Aubry Huff. Both together helped ruin that season. So yeah, you've got to wonder if there's something wrong with the pitcher. If the deal looks to good to be true...:crosseye:

 

[Bob Holmstrom]

Tony LaRussa is like a creaky old house: whiny, dusty, and covered with shingles.

Also, drinky and animal lovey-dovey. He's also 3rd ialltime in wins, soon to be 2nd. And manages the greatest franchise in MLB outside of the Wankees.

 

[Glennbo]

The Tiger's manager leyland did it again. Right after my last post. Alsmost like he read it and wanted to piss me off!

He "rests" four of our starters, the best hitters on the team. Peralta and Avila were smacking the cover off the ball the past few games hitting homers and clutch hits, and he sat them. Apparently he wanted to put more lefties in the lineup or some crap.

So instead of hot hitters in the lineup we get second stringers, and Texas beats us 5-2, and we don't get the sweep. Gee, guess we could of used a few more hot bats that game?

The players keep their mouths shut, but they want to play every day. Avila told the press that he didn't need a rest, but he "understands" why Leyland does it. Well explain it to me because when I watch these guys 90% of the time they're sitting down or standing around looking bored. What they need is some action, not a "rest"!

I think we would have five more wins this season so far if Leyland had gone with the best players every game instead of resting hot hitters.

Leyland is a statistics freak. "Player X doesn't hit left handers well. He's 3-15 against lefties lifetime". Well how the heck is he gonna get any better at it if you sit him out every time a left hander pitches? He hits them poorly because he never gets to face them!

Oh well. I can't complain too much since we're in first place. :shy: