B30.7 and ambush

Michael R

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A concealed German unit is in a pillbox in a woods hex. No unit has fired yet from this pillbox.
A concealed British unit advances into the pillbox hex to engage in CC.
Does the German unit receive the -2 drm to the ambush dr for being concealed?
I think "yes", but I would like other opinions.


TIA
 

jrv

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A concealed German unit is in a pillbox in a woods hex. No unit has fired yet from this pillbox.
A concealed British unit advances into the pillbox hex to engage in CC.
Does the German unit receive the -2 drm to the ambush dr for being concealed?
I think "yes", but I would like other opinions.
They are concealed, no? The drm applies.

JR
 

Vinnie

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30.7 CONCEALMENT: A pillbox Location is Concealment Terrain; however, "?"/HIP in a pillbox neither halves the FP of, nor adds a TH DRM to, an attack on it/its-contents. The contents of a pillbox cannto be inspected by an opposing player except to verify the details of an announced attack (or successful SMOKE placement) from that pillbox. Once an attack has been made (or SMOKE has been placed) from within a pillbox, all units therein (even if they entered-subsequently/did-not-fire-originally) are considered Known to all other units (even those outside the pillbox's CA) within 16 hexes that have/gain a LOS to that pillbox. If a pillbox sets up hidden, so do its contents

Since the ambush is not an attack I think the concealment modifier applies.
 

jrv

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30.7 CONCEALMENT: A pillbox Location is Concealment Terrain; however, "?"/HIP in a pillbox neither halves the FP of, nor adds a TH DRM to, an attack on it/its-contents. The contents of a pillbox cannto be inspected by an opposing player except to verify the details of an announced attack (or successful SMOKE placement) from that pillbox. Once an attack has been made (or SMOKE has been placed) from within a pillbox, all units therein (even if they entered-subsequently/did-not-fire-originally) are considered Known to all other units (even those outside the pillbox's CA) within 16 hexes that have/gain a LOS to that pillbox. If a pillbox sets up hidden, so do its contents

Since the ambush is not an attack I think the concealment modifier applies.
Interesting, though, is that if the unit IN the pillbox declined to attack and so retained concealment, any attack by the enemy outside the pillbox would not be halved. I hadn't noticed that before.

JR
 

Vinnie

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If a concealed unit is ambushed, when does he make the decision to attack or not? It has to be prior to tge ambushers attack I woukd have thought.
 

jrv

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If a concealed unit is ambushed, when does he make the decision to attack or not? It has to be prior to tge ambushers attack I woukd have thought.
If a concealed unit is ambushed, it loses concealment. The decision to retain concealment can only be made by a unit that is not ambushed.

JR
 

klasmalmstrom

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If a concealed unit is ambushed, when does he make the decision to attack or not? It has to be prior to tge ambushers attack I woukd have thought.
As jrv points out, it will lose concealment once it is ambushed. And since it is ambushed it doesn't get to attack before surviving any attacks by the ambusher anyway, so it can't make that decision until it knows it is still alive to make it.
 

jrv

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What I had not really thought about is that even if there is no ambush, a unit in a Pillbox gains no benefit from retaining concealment, unlike a unit not in a Pillbox.

JR
 

Stewart

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interesting note: the pill box typically can set up hidden since it is a fortification, in the US there in may also set up hidden.

once you see the pill box the pill box becomes known yet the hidden units within do not... this way your opponent will not even know if you have anything in the pillbox.

Don't forget the lovely +2 ambush mod
 
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