Arab-Is product

Would you buy Arab-Israeli Product from HOB

  • Yes, would buy it

    Votes: 42 56.8%
  • No, would not buy it

    Votes: 32 43.2%

  • Total voters
    74
  • Poll closed .

Pitman

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Ugh--especially that whole defensive fire during the prep fire thing.
 

Jay White

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I agree with Mark - too complicated. It's going to force new rules-based tactics - drawing Final Fire in the Prep Fire Phase!

Does it create residual in that hex?

Too wierd. I'd at least keep the gameplay the same.

-Jay
 

Achilles

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Robin said:
I was not judging.
Just showing that one can misjudge easily
You just did what you said... :devious:


Robin said:
Thanks for the Swiss anthem - I do see you are cultured.:rolleyes:
Or a good Patriot... :rolleyes:
after all I had to sing it every morning for a long time... :D


Robin said:
In real life, I refused armed service - but serve my country in a Civil Protection unit (i.e. that takes people in charge in case of flood, fire or other big problems).
I served in COLOMBIER Neuchâtel... :surprise:


Robin said:
But I am sure that a Greek like you will chuckle at this last remark, sipping at your glass of ouzzo... :cheeky:
...And if I was somehow a VAUDOIS ? :rolleyes:
 

Gunner Scott

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Guy's;

It's just gonna be a 1948 battle pack, with none of the goofy rules. Kinda a throw back to 1940 in a waird sort of way.


Scott
 

Robin Reeve

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Achilles said:
And if I was somehow a VAUDOIS ? :rolleyes:
So Achilles, behind his Greek identity, is in fact a "Major Davel" (martyr of the Vaudois' quest of freedom against Bern).
So, replace "ouzzo" with "Yvorne" or "Saint-Saph'"...

Besides, I believe you haven't understood my pulling the leg of Jay White, because he was mad at Golani about his signature... I just wrote that one "could" also criticize him - on the basis of his avatar - but of course I did not think a word of the contents of that (mis-)"judgment"...
Irony is a quite frequent rhetorical form of speech, you know...
Switching to French : sans doute un Vaudois prend-t-il son temps pour comprendre, hein ? Santé et conservation! :toast:
 
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ransh

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As an Israeli ASL player, I'd love to see such a product, and I'll be glad to help with research/design.
 

sturmovik

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About the ATGM dragon stuff...I don't really the see the need of simulating the tracking phase. An ASL turn is supposed to last 2 minutes (officially) so why care about a tracking/flight phase that lasts a few seconds? After all, ASL does not care about the correction shots of mortar fire, so what's the point?
 

Jazz

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sturmovik said:
About the ATGM dragon stuff...I don't really the see the need of simulating the tracking phase. An ASL turn is supposed to last 2 minutes (officially) so why care about a tracking/flight phase that lasts a few seconds? After all, ASL does not care about the correction shots of mortar fire, so what's the point?
In '73 a common Israeli practice was, on observing a launch, to suppress with the AAMG the guys guiding the ATGM.

If I recall correctly, the flight time at extreme range was ~20+ seconds (?), which would be 1/6 or 16% of a completel turn, which is not an insignificant portion of the turn.

<shrug> I think it would need to be a dramatically different game, but thats just me....

Jazz
 

Pfc TAZ

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I'd buy it. I always regretted not getting CH Genesis '48 pack when it was available. I wouldn't mind getting some '67 and '73 stuff too.

As for ATGM's, I agree that the 2 minute turn negates the need for detailed flight phase calculations. Launch the missile, allow possible opportunity fire against firer, if OF not effective, then roll to hit against target...that's just my opinion. As for changing the game, it caused the Israeli's to change their tactics, so changing the game in that respect would be good.
 
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graydo

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Pfc TAZ said:
I'd buy it. I always regretted not getting CH Genesis '48 pack when it was available. I wouldn't mind getting some '67 and '73 stuff too.

As for ATGM's, I agree that the 2 minute turn negates the need for detailed flight phase calculations. Launch the missile, allow possible opportunity fire against firer, if OF not effective, then roll to hit against target...that's just my opinion. As for changing the game, it caused the Israeli's to change their tactics, so changing the game in that respect would be good.
I think The Source in Falcon Heights, MN still has a copy of Genesis '48 for sale.

dave
 

Chas

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I appreciate all the input and offers to help, will take you up on that.
However, I am unsure if this poll is now tainted. Somehow this turned to a discussion on ATGM, not the product itself, so I am not sure how valuable the results are.

The general plan is to do a module, probably just focusing on 40-50s, not sure, and then build upon it if there is enough interest down the road. Basically all WWII equipment.

For ATGMs. Several years ago I started to design some modern stuff, but didnt really pursue it very much.

Interestingly, I had a VERY simplistic approach to the ATGMs, and wanted to test it in some action before I approved, but was basically this.

Launched in Prep Fire (counter remains on unit until......

Roll for TH and TK then in Def Final Fire.

This allows a movement phase for the other side between the launch and the effect. Also, the 'target' was written on a side record, so the receiving player didnt know the specific target, could be one of several. Anyway, thought it was relatively simple, portrayed ATGMs well, but never tested it in action.

chas
 

Jazz

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chas said:
I appreciate all the input and offers to help, will take you up on that.
However, I am unsure if this poll is now tainted. Somehow this turned to a discussion on ATGM, not the product itself, so I am not sure how valuable the results are.

The general plan is to do a module, probably just focusing on 40-50s, not sure, and then build upon it if there is enough interest down the road. Basically all WWII equipment.

For ATGMs. Several years ago I started to design some modern stuff, but didnt really pursue it very much.

Interestingly, I had a VERY simplistic approach to the ATGMs, and wanted to test it in some action before I approved, but was basically this.

Launched in Prep Fire (counter remains on unit until......

Roll for TH and TK then in Def Final Fire.

This allows a movement phase for the other side between the launch and the effect. Also, the 'target' was written on a side record, so the receiving player didnt know the specific target, could be one of several. Anyway, thought it was relatively simple, portrayed ATGMs well, but never tested it in action.

chas
Hey Chas,

I think it became a discussion on ATGM 'cause that would be the biggest change required for taking the system to '73? I think it would be a good product and I'd buy it. I think it would have some marked differences from ASL. Could probably be done in a large and extensive expansion module with a hefty RB chapter.

As an alternative sequence for the ATGM you might consider:

In your prep: launch in prep fire, resolve TH/TK in Adv Fire Phase. Gives the defender a chance to suppress.

I your D-Fire: launch at the start of (ala star shells), or during the other side's movement, resolve in the final fire phase after movement is done. Gives the guy moving a chance to try to scurry away.

That way, each shot is made and resolved in the same turn.

I like the idea of a side record as to target.

Like I said, I'd buy it, but I'm an ASL lush....

Jazz
 

da priest

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Chas,

Agree with you things got side tracked. The politicos and their agendas got in here and screwed things up(take it somewhere else guys), and the early AIW vs later AIW stuff confuzzed the issues.

Might want to clarify your thoughts on the possible module, i.e. AIW 40's and 50's, and repost the poll.

Think it's a good idea.

Send the ATGM stuff to the scrap heap of history, until the designers get back to the "effect" thing. Too fiddly as laid out now.
 

Aries

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Bummer I thought someone was thinkng of resurrecting the board game by same name built off Panzerblitz/Leader initially.

Not so confident that post WW2 is so infinitely doable.

Maybe some of the very early actions, but I tend to get uninterested past the 67 war.

I have the same sort of support for a Korean action.

If the same hardware (more or less)is being used, it is not so hard a stretch, but the moment the modern tech creeps in, not sure how possible the game's systems can hold up.

The guys trying to modify Steel Panthers came up against the same brick wall.
 

Gunner Scott

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Wow!


I actually agree with the old crotchity da priest, ya your gonna have to reset this poll and I recommend it say 1947-49 A/I battle pack so people will realize that its not pushing the limits of the ASL system nor going beyond said dates. Perhaps another poll would be needed for a 1950 and beyond type of battle pack.


Scott
 

Klaus Fischer

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Yes, a better defined poll would clear some things up.

And Yes, I think a 194x - 5x Arab-Israeli War pack would be within the current ASL (rules) boundaries and could easily be portrait.

So, Chas, why don't you make a new, clearer defined poll?

Klaus
 

RobZagnut

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I wouldn't buy it. I'm not interested in that theatre and time period. I would rather see HoB spend their time and efforts on WWII.
 

Klaus Fischer

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On the ATGM thingy:

When I originally made these "rules" up in the early 90's, ASL was slowly drifting from the design for effect camp into the reality area.
Since a ATGM travels considerably slower than a normal "shot" I wanted to simulate the actual travel time (Tracking) and the doctrine of Suppressive Fire - and instead of Design for Effect, I ended up with that "clutter".
Using Jazz' approach of
launch in prep fire, resolve TH/TK in Adv Fire Phase. Gives the defender a chance to suppress.
In your D-Fire: launch at the start of (ala star shells), or during the other side's movement, resolve in the final fire phase after movement is done. Gives the guy moving a chance to try to scurry away.
would've been simpler and more elegant. But what about Opportunity Firers? Shouldn't they be able to interfere (supress)?

Well, maybe we should carry this over to a new thread?

Klaus
 

Chas Argent

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To reiterate, something on the '47-'48 war would fit perfectly into ASL-same weapons, same tactics. As to the later A-I wars, I think it's too far beyond what ASL is capable of.
 

Gunner Scott

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Agreed! the 47-49 A/I wars reminds me of the spanish civil war but instead of a mish mash of different european nationalities, it's the flipside of different arabic and eastern european nationaliies fighting for control of palastine.

So if you liked the Spanish civil war, I think most poeple should like the A/I wars of 1947-49.

Scott


Chas Argent said:
To reiterate, something on the '47-'48 war would fit perfectly into ASL-same weapons, same tactics. As to the later A-I wars, I think it's too far beyond what ASL is capable of.
 
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