Any chance a 3rd Ed. ASLRB will be published?

apbills

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Solution...MMP granting TPPs the right to do added pages numbered for insertion in the rulesbook. We see a lot more HASL from third party publisher's. And we will surely see a lot more. MMP's focus on Geoboards has made HASL a unplumbed gold mine for TTP's.
Not sure just how focused MMP is on Geoboards to the detriment of HASL boards. I have no idea how many TPP products there are, but I have 16 Official non-Geo boards (HASL or mini-HASL) in the products I own, with 2 more on the way (hopefully within a year). Since I don't have a lot of TPP I can't really compare. I only own 3 to date (all of which I consider quality products). I would say that 21 boards is hardly an "unplumbed gold mine". Its the product that counts, not just another board.
 

Robin Reeve

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The rulebook has the base rules of the system.
Adding rules specific to a given HASL is rather useless: either you have the HASL - and its additional rules - either not, and you don't need those rules.
As for letting TPP add their rules to the rulebook, that is giving them a degree of officiality which is not welcome. And CH! would add hundreds of "unique" pages of trash rules just to make money.
The ASLRB is already a large set of rules.
Drowning it with HASL and other rules would make it an overweight monster.
 

Eagle4ty

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I could see some HASL rules being brought forward into the ASLRB just as Narrow Village Roads, Stream Hex Terrain, Steeples, etc. were. Some rules could be introduced if they were commonly encountered on the "general" nature of battlefields and easily integrated into the general ASL playbook. A few I thought that would have some veracity are RB/FB type Cellars and Debris (especially good for built-up "city" boards) , KGP type bombardments (very similar to rocket OBA) for pre-game or turn 1 prepatory suppression barrages, and drainage ditches (quite common in the Low Countries, Middle East and Philippines to mention a few spots). Overall however, I agree most HASL specific rules are just that, especially TPP offerings which have no place in the "official" BOB (though at times I wish the official rulings would pick up on a few of the minor modifications offered by them [EX: The ATR-Sz effect in BFP's CoS and such]).
 

larrymarak

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I wasn't recommend making them official...just granting TPPs permission to produce pages that individual owners can enter into your notebooks.
 

Eagle4ty

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I wasn't recommend making them official...just granting TPPs permission to produce pages that individual owners can enter into your notebooks.
This already exists from most TPPs in hard copy form already and fairly reasonable assumption that if MMP were to produce an eASLRB, some, if not most, TPPs would attempt to follow suit in their efforts to produce a compatible addendum for their products as well. JMHO
 

RandyT0001

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Solution...MMP granting TPPs the right to do added pages numbered for insertion in the rulesbook. We see a lot more HASL from third party publisher's. And we will surely see a lot more. MMP's focus on Geoboards has made HASL a unplumbed gold mine for TTP's.
I doubt that MMP has that freedom. Hasbro owns Advanced Squad Leader, not MMP. MMP has an exclusive license to produce and sell it for Hasbro, paying royalties to Hasbro for that privilege. Hasbro is not going to sign another license with any TPP to produce additional pages for inserting into the rulebook, thereby violating their agreement with MMP and in effect abandoning their copyright ownership of ASL. If a designer creates a HASL and wants it integrated into official ASL material then he has to sell it through MMP. There are several TPPs that design, conduct rigorous playtests, make revisions, and repeat that corrective loop several times to produce a good ASL product. There is also one TPP, with scores and scores of titles, that does not follow that pattern and publishes low quality material, woefully inadequately play tested, seeking only a constant influx of cash, so much so, previous editions are retitled and sold or marginally re-edited and sold as updated titles, only to need another re-edit a year later.
 

Tuomo

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Hm. If MMP is required to (or simply makes the choice to) close their eASLRB so that TPPs can't add their stuff, it would also close off another add-on that I'm excited about - user-created content such as more examples, links to Q&A, etc.

I suppose one could still propose such an add-on to MMP and hope to sell them in the idea to the point where they'd be open to adopting such a thing, but it'd be hard to develop a prototype without an actual functional environment to work in.

OTOH, this is probably not their main goal with the eASLRB, and not much of a concern for many people out there. There simply aren't that many content creators out there. Still, I'm very curious what the plan is in this regard; I think the eASLRB could be much more than just an e-version of the paper rulebook and it'd be cool to see what could be done along those lines.
 

RandyT0001

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An electronic version of the paper rulebook would mean that MMP loses control over the distribution of the rules and loses money. This is not the same as a 40 page set of rules for a GMT or Decision Games product. I remind people that Hasbro owns ASL and MMP licenses to produce and sell ASL for Hasbro for royalty payments. With an official electronic version of the ASL rules, it will be shared with friends to save them money (depriving MMP monies for payments). Bootleg copies with be distributed. As of now there is no electronic version of the rules and if MMP finds some posted on a website they can pursue the offender with a cease and desist order and a civil lawsuit if necessary.

If you want to play Advanced Squad Leader, you should buy the paper rulebook and support MMP.
 

larrymarak

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Definitely...every one should buy one or the other versions of the ASLRB. Had Hasbro not licensed it, it would have become a long forgotten video game cartridge and ASLRBs would be something you'd look for at yard sales.
 

larrymarak

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I doubt that MMP has that freedom. Hasbro owns Advanced Squad Leader, not MMP. MMP has an exclusive license to produce and sell it for Hasbro, paying royalties to Hasbro for that privilege. Hasbro is not going to sign another license with any TPP to produce additional pages for inserting into the rulebook, thereby violating their agreement with MMP and in effect abandoning their copyright ownership of ASL. If a designer creates a HASL and wants it integrated into official ASL material then he has to sell it through MMP. There are several TPPs that design, conduct rigorous playtests, make revisions, and repeat that corrective loop several times to produce a good ASL product. There is also one TPP, with scores and scores of titles, that does not follow that pattern and publishes low quality material, woefully inadequately play tested, seeking only a constant influx of cash, so much so, previous editions are retitled and sold or marginally re-edited and sold as updated titles, only to need another re-edit a year later.
I agree in the main, but with nearly 40 years of official scenarios, even MMP is committed to reprinting and reselling previously published material, slightly upgraded. NOTHING wrong with that...they are preserving the game's heritage.
 

hongkongwargamer

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I agree in the main, but with nearly 40 years of official scenarios, even MMP is committed to reprinting and reselling previously published material, slightly upgraded. NOTHING wrong with that...they are preserving the game's heritage.
MMP upgrades are done in the same titles as to leave NO doubts that theres an older product

MMP also sell modules that rigorously playtested and carefully QC right out of the gates. They dont sell playtest kit as a full product and charge clients for "corrected" products and call it an upgrade (or pretend its an entirely different product),

There is NO moral equivalency between CH and pretty much anyone else in the field.

Lets just cut the crap.
 

Robin Reeve

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The ASLRB is not "closed": we simply need a common, controlled, set of rules, with only one authority to decide modifications or additions.
There could be some new terrains added, as has been done previously, but the conservative stance of MMP has saved us from dispersion and anarchy.
 

Philippe D.

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With an official electronic version of the ASL rules, it will be shared with friends to save them money (depriving MMP monies for payments). Bootleg copies with be distributed.
Of course bootleg copies will be distributed. Just as there are bootleg copies of the paper rulebook. Just as there are people making copies of scenarios and not buying them.

The thing is, while this does exist, it's certainly a very small percentage of the player base. Possibly, a small group decided they wanted to try the game, one of them bought it, and other made copies so they could read the rules by themselves - then they never get to buying it. I know there are unofficial translations (at least into French), and despite the imperfect translations, some will get by with just that. Or, some are just dishonest and will take advantage, just because they can.

Preventing copies is a losing battle nowadays. A better way to fight piracy is to provide practical bonuses to paying customers. Like an eASLRB that is kept up to date regularly, or whatever. There are more honest than dishonest people out there.

If you want to play Advanced Squad Leader, you should buy the paper rulebook and support MMP.
True. And many here already own more than one copy (3 in my case: 1st ed, 2nd ed, pocket), and will likely buy one more when a new one is available.
 

Pacman Ghost

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...it would also close off another add-on that I'm excited about - user-created content such as more examples, links to Q&A, etc.

I suppose one could still propose such an add-on to MMP and hope to sell them in the idea to the point where they'd be open to adopting such a thing, but it'd be hard to develop a prototype without an actual functional environment to work in.
I've already built this :)

eASLRB-1.png I scanned my copy of the ASLRB, and built a search engine for the index. When you click on a search result, it jumps to the corresponding rule in the RB. In the screenshot, I've searched for "encircle", and clicked on the A7.7 result.

eASLRB-2.png If there are any errata or Q+A associated with the rule you click on, they become available as well. User annotations are on the to-do list, and it would be easy to add examples and other notes.

I'd love to be able to make this available to the ASL community, but I don't think it'd fly. I'd obviously have to take out the scanned rulebook, making it just a search engine over the index, with integrated errata and Q+A, but even that would be quite useful. But it's built on top of the ASLRB index, so while I wouldn't be republishing it and so not a copyright issue, I think there may well be IP issues. I'd be happy to be corrected on this... :)
 
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Abe

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I think quite a few people have. It's depressing the amount of wasted effort we've all gone to because we got sick of waiting for an official eASLRB... :mad:
maybe one day ASL will be dragged clicking and screening into the 21st century. Until then it’s flap-flap-flap-flap.
 

TopT

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I think quite a few people have. It's depressing the amount of wasted effort we've all gone to because we got sick of waiting for an official eASLRB... :mad:
but therein lies the problem, MMP has been working on an eASLRB for a few years now and when finished you will get Ch's. A - E

I have 85% of all official MMP stuff in an eASLRB (fully searchable). That is a huge step back for me and quite a few others. That is not saying that I will not purchase this.
 
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