Anti-Sniper Sniping

witchbottles

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A typical game of ASL, you are the defender with a SAN of 4 ( or even 5 perhaps). The Attacker has a SAN of 2 (maybe a 3, not any higher). Do you position your SAN counter on setup to place the Attacker's SAN counter on one of the kill lanes? In all likelihood, with your SAN 4 and his a 2, you are around 3.5 times as likely to get a SAN result than he is. (8.3% vice 2.8%). A selection on a 1 result for a SAN activation that tags his SAN counter with an enemy SAN of "2" means you are now free from SAN fears for the rest of the game, while he must still fret the SAN 4 you are wielding. a "2" pin result on his SAN will incapacitate it at least until the end of the turn, and keep your SAN counter in prime position to continue targeting his SAN.

Corollary - the game has moved past the physical locations of your SAN counter early on and there is still a lot of game left, and you still have the SAN 4 while his is still a SAN 2. You roll a "2" result on a SAN trigger, do you relocate your SAN counter to then place his SAN counter in one of your kill lanes?



Remember a "kill lane" is one of the direct radii from the SAN counter from 1-6 hexes from that SAN counter.

This tactic seems to offer a ASL player a bit more control over the use of SAN than the rules might otherwise provide. Kind of like instructing your sniper before he goes out "...look for enemy snipers first. Only shoot another enemy if it is safe and no enemy snipers appear to be present...". There are no guarantees the SAN counter will tag the enemy SAN counter, but if it is on a kill lane, and you have a good advantage over a SAN 2, it seems a plausible strategy for either initial placement or an early "2" activation result, to place the enemy SAN counter so it is in one of your SAN counter kill lanes.

Thoughts?
 

Michael R

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FWIW, placement of one's sniper counter does not normally involve the enemy sniper by the rules. Therefore, rule requirements might prevent you from threatening the enemy sniper.
 

hongkongwargamer

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A typical game of ASL, you are the defender with a SAN of 4 ( or even 5 perhaps). The Attacker has a SAN of 2 (maybe a 3, not any higher). Do you position your SAN counter on setup to place the Attacker's SAN counter on one of the kill lanes? In all likelihood, with your SAN 4 and his a 2, you are around 3.5 times as likely to get a SAN result than he is. (8.3% vice 2.8%). A selection on a 1 result for a SAN activation that tags his SAN counter with an enemy SAN of "2" means you are now free from SAN fears for the rest of the game, while he must still fret the SAN 4 you are wielding. a "2" pin result on his SAN will incapacitate it at least until the end of the turn, and keep your SAN counter in prime position to continue targeting his SAN.

Corollary - the game has moved past the physical locations of your SAN counter early on and there is still a lot of game left, and you still have the SAN 4 while his is still a SAN 2. You roll a "2" result on a SAN trigger, do you relocate your SAN counter to then place his SAN counter in one of your kill lanes?



Remember a "kill lane" is one of the direct radii from the SAN counter from 1-6 hexes from that SAN counter.

This tactic seems to offer a ASL player a bit more control over the use of SAN than the rules might otherwise provide. Kind of like instructing your sniper before he goes out "...look for enemy snipers first. Only shoot another enemy if it is safe and no enemy snipers appear to be present...". There are no guarantees the SAN counter will tag the enemy SAN counter, but if it is on a kill lane, and you have a good advantage over a SAN 2, it seems a plausible strategy for either initial placement or an early "2" activation result, to place the enemy SAN counter so it is in one of your SAN counter kill lanes.

Thoughts?
In ITR5 FIRE TEAMs .. thru a lot of luck and some positioning .. the American sniper did knock the German SAN from 5 to a 2. I tell you it does "liberate" the US forces across the battlefield
 

witchbottles

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FWIW, placement of one's sniper counter does not normally involve the enemy sniper by the rules. Therefore, rule requirements might prevent you from threatening the enemy sniper.
extremely careful setup can prevent a player from placing a SAN counter within 6 hexes of at least 6 enemy units in some scenarios, and not allow them to also align a kill lane to the enemy SAN counter at the same time. Most attackers are typically not so cautious in their setup to prevent this altogether.

Further , in any scenario with the attacker entering form offboard, you can place your SAN counter anywhere - at so the enemy SAN counte4r is a prime target.


Once play begins a "2" resolution result will not save an enemy SAN counter from a re-placement to align the enemy SAN counter to a SAN kill lane unless similar care was taken in the play of attacking units up to that point. .
 

von Marwitz

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Just me, but I'd rather kill his 9-2.

JR
This.

An enemy Sniper with a low SAN is less likely to do any (more) damage than a squad with an MG which will likely be firing severals times during the game. So it might be a better idea to "up" the chances of having the Sniper hit one of those. Remember that half of the SAN Activations hitting the Sniper would merely Pin it.

If a SAN activation gives me the opportunity to eliminate the enemy Sniper, I will usually do that. If not, I would mostly select other enemy units as a target.

von Marwitz
 

Vinnie

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Generally, I will ignore the enemy sniper counter. The effect of a small sniper attack on him is not very much, I prefer to go for the units.
 

witchbottles

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Generally, I will ignore the enemy sniper counter. The effect of a small sniper attack on him is not very much, I prefer to go for the units.
The game effect of a "1" resolution dr on an enemy SAN counter when his SAN only begins at 2 is profound, and magnified if it occurs early in a game. The enemy SAN counter becomes removed for the rest of the game for being reduced to <2, and you are now free to take every low odds shot possible in order to both generate effects and your own SAN from the possible enemy TCs and/or MCs (which in this case, is quite more probable as the example is a friendly SAN of 4).

So given the opportunity, would you attempt to set this up on purpose? (By placement or relocation of your own SAN counter.) - if your SAN was 4 and his was only a 2?
 

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Given that low odds shots are still low odds, I can't say that I would rate the change from two SAN to zero as profound. I was playing some ASLSK recently, and the difference is that rather than think about low odds shots I just took them. I would be much more inclined to target the Sniper if the SAN were high (seven or six, or possibly five) rather than low. And even then I'd probably target a -2 or better leader if one were present.

JR
 

witchbottles

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Given that low odds shots are still low odds, I can't say that I would rate the change from two SAN to zero as profound. I was playing some ASLSK recently, and the difference is that rather than think about low odds shots I just took them. I would be much more inclined to target the Sniper if the SAN were high (seven or six, or possibly five) rather than low. And even then I'd probably target a -2 or better leader if one were present.

JR
The bolded portion is exactly why it may be of some benefit to remove a SAN 2 early on in a game by purposely targeting it as much as possible. Moreso if your SAN is a 4 or a 5, the resulting effects from those low odds shots are going to earn you opportunities for the rest of the game to activate your higher SAN # with his resulting TCs and MCs DRs.
 

witchbottles

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In a CG if my SAN is 2 i may attempt to position my sniper counter as a target to keep you from hitting my 9-2. Sniper will come back for free...
a SAN counter is an effective sniper bait at any number, _ I would be more inclined to use it as such if it were a higher SAN # though - a 5 or a 6. Keeping even a SAN 2 on the board makes one's opponent think before he pulls the trigger on low odds shots like the 2+3 light mortar attacks on stone buildings. Kill his SAN 2 off completely, on purpose, early on, and those same mortars can fire at enemy in stone buildings until the barrels melt to no ill effect on your troops.
 

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If I'm going to shoot, I shoot. The enemy SANdoes come into it but very very rarely.
If it is high, it is more likely to affect my decision than it being 2.
 

witchbottles

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If I'm going to shoot, I shoot. The enemy SANdoes come into it but very very rarely.
If it is high, it is more likely to affect my decision than it being 2.
if it is SAN 2 or SAN 0 are you going to shoot more at SAN 0? If so, would you consciously decide to attempt to create the SAN 0 condition from his SAN 2?
 

Eagle4ty

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if it is SAN 2 or SAN 0 are you going to shoot more at SAN 0? If so, would you consciously decide to attempt to create the SAN 0 condition from his SAN 2?
Nah, if it's a 2 I don't give it another thought, what happens, happens; a 2 may as well be a 0 for all I give it credence. Like others have said, a Sniper of 4+ may warrent some attention but only if it is in a zone of effect of my sniper placed to effect other important enemy units as well. Too many players worry about snipers too much, it's just another counter in your bag of tricks and usually a not too critical one at that.
 

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if it is SAN 2 or SAN 0 are you going to shoot more at SAN 0? If so, would you consciously decide to attempt to create the SAN 0 condition from his SAN 2?
As others have said, SAN of 2 or 0 makes little difference yo my firing. Generally there are more important targets for my sniper other than his sniper.
 

Carln0130

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As others have said, SAN of 2 or 0 makes little difference yo my firing. Generally there are more important targets for my sniper other than his sniper.
Agreed. As the SAN goes up, the more thought you give to the low odds stuff, but SAN of 2 is only going to have a chance to activate one shot in 36 and then only 1/3 of the time. Just not intimidating. It forms no deterrent to me either.
 

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The position of my SAN counter has mostly to do with where his best leaders are ... not the opposing SAN counter
 
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MajorDomo

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A typical game of ASL, you are the defender with a SAN of 4 ( or even 5 perhaps). The Attacker has a SAN of 2 (maybe a 3, not any higher). Do you position your SAN counter on setup to place the Attacker's SAN counter on one of the kill lanes? In all likelihood, with your SAN 4 and his a 2, you are around 3.5 times as likely to get a SAN result than he is. (8.3% vice 2.8%). A selection on a 1 result for a SAN activation that tags his SAN counter with an enemy SAN of "2" means you are now free from SAN fears for the rest of the game, while he must still fret the SAN 4 you are wielding. a "2" pin result on his SAN will incapacitate it at least until the end of the turn, and keep your SAN counter in prime position to continue targeting his SAN.

Corollary - the game has moved past the physical locations of your SAN counter early on and there is still a lot of game left, and you still have the SAN 4 while his is still a SAN 2. You roll a "2" result on a SAN trigger, do you relocate your SAN counter to then place his SAN counter in one of your kill lanes?



Remember a "kill lane" is one of the direct radii from the SAN counter from 1-6 hexes from that SAN counter.

This tactic seems to offer a ASL player a bit more control over the use of SAN than the rules might otherwise provide. Kind of like instructing your sniper before he goes out "...look for enemy snipers first. Only shoot another enemy if it is safe and no enemy snipers appear to be present...". There are no guarantees the SAN counter will tag the enemy SAN counter, but if it is on a kill lane, and you have a good advantage over a SAN 2, it seems a plausible strategy for either initial placement or an early "2" activation result, to place the enemy SAN counter so it is in one of your SAN counter kill lanes.

Thoughts?
Yes as a "2" SAN attacker, I often place my sniper near the enemy sniper to absorb its attack.

Losing a "2" sniper is really not much of a loss after all.

The other option is to put the sniper next to any friendly killstack, sniper in open ground, to protect the killstack leader. This assumes the killstack will not be moving with the attack. Sometimes will put the sniper where I anticipate my killstack will later call home.

Rich
 

ecz

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A typical game of ASL, you are the defender with a SAN of 4 ( or even 5 perhaps). The Attacker has a SAN of 2 (maybe a 3, not any higher). Do you position your SAN counter on setup to place the Attacker's SAN counter on one of the kill lanes? In all likelihood, with your SAN 4 and his a 2, you are around 3.5 times as likely to get a SAN result than he is. (8.3% vice 2.8%). A selection on a 1 result for a SAN activation that tags his SAN counter with an enemy SAN of "2" means you are now free from SAN fears for the rest of the game, while he must still fret the SAN 4 you are wielding. a "2" pin result on his SAN will incapacitate it at least until the end of the turn, and keep your SAN counter in prime position to continue targeting his SAN.

Corollary - the game has moved past the physical locations of your SAN counter early on and there is still a lot of game left, and you still have the SAN 4 while his is still a SAN 2. You roll a "2" result on a SAN trigger, do you relocate your SAN counter to then place his SAN counter in one of your kill lanes?



Remember a "kill lane" is one of the direct radii from the SAN counter from 1-6 hexes from that SAN counter.

This tactic seems to offer a ASL player a bit more control over the use of SAN than the rules might otherwise provide. Kind of like instructing your sniper before he goes out "...look for enemy snipers first. Only shoot another enemy if it is safe and no enemy snipers appear to be present...". There are no guarantees the SAN counter will tag the enemy SAN counter, but if it is on a kill lane, and you have a good advantage over a SAN 2, it seems a plausible strategy for either initial placement or an early "2" activation result, to place the enemy SAN counter so it is in one of your SAN counter kill lanes.

Thoughts?
My opinion is that this kind of tactic is perfect to allow the Enemy to stay CE with his AFVs when he shouldn't.

Personally when the enemy Sniper kills my "SAN 2 " Sniper ignoring a OT tank or my 9-2 it's what I call a minor success and I'm happy . If he only pins it, then it's a major success and I celebrate until the next enemy SAN event.
 
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