ABtF AAR!

[Jay White]

Thanks, "Legion"! I'll try out this CG someday, and it sounds like the big 'un is the one to go for. I love looking for ways to win in an unwinnable situation, so this is tempting!

-Jay

 

[PZchala]

I am playing this as the Germans in CGIII, my first CG. It is now 18EVE, and have suffered heavy losses, but was able to get my licks in on the British in 18PM, 42cvp-29cvp, and hang on to block N. CVP is 92-58 in favor of the British for the entire CG.
How does that CVP total look to others who have played this?

I screwed up my 18AM purchases by forgetting CG22, and buying 3 I1 RG from KG Brinkman, and one I5 from the same. We played on after I noticed, but I wonder if this rules gaffe has helped or hurt me as far as how the CG has progressed. For example, elements of KG Graebner have not entered unitl 18EVE, and it is doubtful that any will survive the gauntlet that the Brits have been able to throw up over the last three CG scenarios.

 

[Legion]

CVP is 92-58 in favor of the British for the entire CG.
How does that CVP total look to others who have played this?

You are KILLING him! If you are only at 18EVE and have killed THAT many Brits, he is doomed :skull:

Just out of interest with our game at 19PM i have killed about 140CVP of the Germans to just 20CVP of my own Brits... but i am in deepest trouble now...
:violin:

 

[Legion]

We have finished the 19PM game of our ABtF CGIII; it is all over bar the AAR writing, and that might take a bit of time. Sorry for the delay, my fault, i spend quite some time in Europe every Jan-Feb and it was impossible to keep something as intense as a CG going during that time.

This battle was a VERY nasty one with the Germans charging onboard and swamping my outer pickets... but a scratch defence by the next Blocks left the street littered with BurntOut AFVs, HTs and wasted squads. The heavy WP usage had the unforseen effect of burning a lot of the city down and much of it seemed to be in the German control area or through where they had to attack - it was accidental, honest :halo:

The city is a disaster zone, and for a bit of fun i have uploaded the VASL map of the city in its current state (had to give the file a .txt extension to allow it to be uploeaded, but VASL will still recognise it). I have removed the extensive HIP fortifications in Block H as the Germans have not had LOS there yet and i dont want to ruin the surprise for them.

Casualties were heavy on both sides with my crews bearing a lot of the punishment due to the enemy commanders anger at the WP success!

The devastated city has been fixed up as per JPs work and Jays suggestion (below) to use the sexier overlays!

 

[Legion]

OK AARs are written and should be up soon in the AAR section... it was a real beating of a game!

 

[Jay White]

Thanks for a peek at the map, it always makes a post more interesting to see a map!

I would suggest using the rubble overlays - it looks WAY sexier!

-Jay

 

[Legion]

Hey there Jay, JP just converted it to the overlays the other day - i didn't even know about them :nuts: - and yes, i think sexier was exactly the word he used... Have replaced the previous file with the "sexed-up" version.

Reepicheep is just waiting for the info on the new posting protocals before he puts up the AARs... hope you enjoy them!

 

[Reepicheep]

Okay... finally we have the AARs up and in place!

You can find them by going to the main Warfare HQ webpage and you'll see them as the first of the current "Recent Features".

Or you use this quick link instead to take you to our ASL Section HQ and you'll find the links inside the New Article with the nifty graphic!

 

[Legion]

Well, it's over... the magnificent use of the massive German OBA resources and a combination of troop numbers and playing time made this too much for me to continue...

I have conceeded to JP in the 19EVE turn...

The AAR will be up soon.

 

[J P]

Was a good nailbiting game and both of us were in doubt about the outcome for a long while. I made the mistake of trying to win the game using my infantry but once i changed tactics and started buying OBA, Arty, tanks and MG's my sheer weight of firepower gave me an attrition rate on the Brits that was guaranteed to leave him with a dozen squads to defend the last block at Games end. (The moment he advanced a concealed unit into my LOS to "hold" the front line i was able to fire up to half a dozen units at it and would eventually score a CR thus slowly reducing his force).

The game was won by using the historical tactics so I can't take much credit for it, we played B.I. rules and the Germans were reduced to '1' after the first game although i am not a fan of B.I. it was, quite honestly, the only thing that gave the Brits some chance of winning. I would be very surprised to read of any Brit, that won this game and although it was enjoyable i question whether it is replayable and, more to the point question MMP's ethics in releasing such a biased game. The amount of playtesting must also be questioned (or the skill of the testers!).

 

[Reepicheep]

For what it's worth (if it's worth), ROAR has CG III in favor of the Germans at 13:3... which is 81/19 pro-German.

 

[jimfer]

ABtF is fun. I believe the Germans will win a majority of the CGIII games played. I would hope that knowing this most of the old guard will play it to see if they can pull out a British win. You get the bragging rights then. Urban fighting can be a "blast". "See that building now you don't". I had a hip 1/2 squad and FT it KIA'd a stack of 3 SS infantry and a 10-2 ldr. They zeed the RS roll. Sweet! This CG will offer many ASL moments. Some times the ROAR has to be ignored.

Jimfer

 

[Beseler]

nothing is perfect....

the guys who write the absolute best aars in the world....cut out mid story again!!!

Jay White and I are continuing in PBCG, into day one now (after he was cleared from the map in night 2)

The battle is currently raging in Le Port, to make way for Lovatt and his men. In Night 3, b/c we continued, we had a fight in an area of the pb map that hardly ever sees action.

All this to say, obviously we all play CGs for different reasons. I love the experience, and sure, it's extremely likely that Jay will lose, but what a story to get there! So different than any other playing we've read about. And all those intriguing little stories along the way.

I'm deeply disappointed that you guys packed it in so early, especially when what is supposed to happen is happening. Don't really know what you guys expected.

alas, thank you so much for your incredible AARs, and what can we look forward to next from you two?

 

[Reepicheep]

The other problem with relying on ROAR statistics to determine whether or not a scenario or CG is balanced is that you don't see the close ones, the ones where a player dropped out for RL reasons and neither do you have any way to determine the abilities of the players involved. Neither do you have any guarantee that the less favored side used the best tactics possible.

So for all those reasons, just because a CG seems heavily slanted towards one side is no reason to knock the company that produced it as not having playtested it thoroughly enough. For all you know, the playtesters developed better tactics from playing to playing such that they found it balanced on a subsequent playthrough.

 

[Legion]

For what it's worth (if it's worth), ROAR has CG III in favor of the Germans at 13:3... which is 81/19 pro-German.

Well, i hope (and maybe i can twist JP's arm too) to write a piece on strategy and tactics for this monster CG.

One of the first things that comes to mind reading the 13:3 ratio above is how many British players took it to the end... we, or better to say, I, decided it was time to stop... but mainly because the time it would have taken to get a clear result would have been at least another year since we play with VASL logfiles... and i think that JP had made enough of an impact in his choice of tactics and long-term force manipulation (his speciality) to pretty much decide this CG BUT one thing i am certian of, if we played it out it would have been a close fought end.

There were many times that JP thought of surrendering, my start was excellent and it takes the Germans a long time to build up their forces... if the DRs had swung the other way it might be me who would be wearing the laural-leaf crown! This was the first and only time i had considered conceeding... but that was enough for me!

 

[Legion]

I'm deeply disappointed that you guys packed it in so early, especially when what is supposed to happen is happening. Don't really know what you guys expected.

Alas, thank you so much for your incredible AARs, and what can we look forward to next from you two?

Thanks mate, really appreciate that... it takes a LONG time to play and write these up... and with JP getting a promotion at work and me having to fly back and forth between Europe and Oz AND having study and exams... well, it is a lot of work... this was all part of the decision...

There were still going to be about another 8 more games to go... and unfortunately unlike some of the more open terrain games like KGP or PB each game from now on would have been exactly the same... my Brits hunkered down in Block H and his German's attacking from all sides with masses of OBA, Guns and AFVs with the occasional infantry sorty. I dont mind going through this in a FTF... it is quick and there is a week or so between games to re-build the PELR... but to loadup VASL every day to face the same thing, with only a sniper and my own small OBA as sole offensive options was too much to face!

In the end we just came to see that the result was going to be reasaonably clear, and that we had more to offer (to the AAR community) and learn from starting up Edison's Ridge... which we will have done before we could have finished the ABtF CG!

I totally agree with you about this being the way the CG was supposed to go... The British tactics of not hunting for fights but just forming a strongly fortified defensive position is the best way to go for them... and that is straight from the pages of history... likewise the SS somehow just dont seem to be their fearsome best against the Brits... thus OBA and AFVs are the main offensive weapon for the Germans. I wanted to play this CG as the Brits to test my ideas for a 'sulking defence' and i now give those tactics a total thumbs-up...

Anyway... we still got the VASL log-files... maybe later we can finish it off... but for now it is time to move on

 

[J P]

Legion and i were playing KGP FtF a few years ago and he wanted to surrender, i convinced him that his position was stronger than he thought and that he wasn't aware of what was going through my mind and it was worth playing on. Suffice to say, he ended up winning, so this time when he offered the surrender i grabbed it with both hands!!!

He would have lost in the end, i changed my emphasis from gaining blocks to killing Brits and set myself a target of 6 brit squads dead per game, ten games until the end, 60 squads dead, that would leave a dozen or so defending 'H' at games end. However, the potency of the 150mm arty came as a surprise to both of us and i feel it was the final demoralizing factor for him as about 8 of his 12 squad equivelants lost in this game were from the OBA. - (I scored a CH on a trench with 2 mortars and an AT gun and the attendant crews - all rolled a '2' on RS!!)

We are going to play a scenario with me as the Japs. (i have never played them before) and then, with the knowledge of how to attack as the Japs i will be defending as the Marines in Edsons ridge.

I would still like to play ABTF once more as i feel the Brits only chance is to have block 'N' as well, it is the only block where you can run from OBA/attacks and still maintain enough presence to hold the block, in my mind it is the cornerstone of the defence in the eastern side of the board and once the Germans have it the Brits are pushed out of that side of the board quickly. It would take some extremely agressive attacking on the 17Night turn to get it though.

 

[Reepicheep]

I'd post Legion and JP's AAR on what used to be Warfare HQ, although it's very difficult to access at the moment. I was then going to upload the zip files here, but they have exceeded the size limit! ARgh!

Will try and get someone to increase the size I can post or some other workaround.

Andrew

 

[Reepicheep]

Ah... I temporarily have been allowed a higher Kb limit for the attachment!

Here 'tis...

 

[Legion]

I am assuming that is both the British and German AARs... right?

Hmmm.... i fthere is to be no more AAR page here it might be time to dust off the FrontPage and make a web-page for them...