AAR - The Backhand Blow - DB045

[Major Issues]

I took some time off from taking naked selfies to play The Backhand Blow with Walt Harrar.


"Playing ASL with that loser all day???
Even though I TOLD you we were going antique shopping?!!!"

Kharkov 1943. Combo of city and open terrain. The SS get points for CVPs, exit, multi-hex buildings, and style. Soviet CVPs are subtracted. The Soviets get a fortified factory with everyone in it Fanatic, 2 HIP guns, 2 HIP squads, Molotovs, 4 HIP T-34s, and some mines. SS get 13 squads and 7 AFVs, including 3 Tigers.

Walt chose not to defend most of the board, giving up most of the multi-hex buildings and concentrating his defense in the fortified factory.


My SS were crushin' it the first couple turns. A HS with a 50 MTR broke it on his first shot, his 57L AT tried to DI a Tiger, missed, then broke on a shot at a squad at one hex range. His two HIP squads and a 8-0 shot at my killer stack of a 9-2 and 3 squads in woods at 1 hex range. He broke one squad, but return fire (36-1!!!) broke and ELRed all three of his units. On the minus side, a HIP T-34 immobilized a PzKw IV at one hex range, then murdered the crew when they decided to come out instead of waiting for AAA.

I take out the T-34 and the gun crew. Moving the Tigers up, I find two T-34s hiding in the gully, who try for DI and miss. My PzKw III and PzKw IV move behind a wall so they can shoot into the factory. Unfortunately, this puts them in LOS of his 45LL AT gun,



who takes them both out, maintains ROF, and turns to work on one Tiger. Continues keeping ROF, and after 3 shots, immobilizes it. Shoots about another 7 times hoping for a CH. I am not exaggerating.

My Tigers Advancing Fire at his adjacent T-34s. Two hits, one burns, the other shot bounces. From a Tiger. At one hex range. With a 10-2 AL. Heavy Sigh.

I shoot up his guys across the street from the factory. Return fire from the factory breaks a couple of my squads and the 9-2. I decide that taking on the factory ain't gonna happen.

Meanwhile, at the other end of the board, a squad and HS surround his broken formerly HIP units to eliminate them for failure to rout. But his sniper breaks my HS. My 658 shoots and eliminates his HS, but the others get away. Before I can ruin their day, they rally, and try to CC my 658 with a 7-0 and a 527. We end up in Melee.

Next turn, he rolls a 12 on his CC attack, and I decide to withdraw. His Prep, I pass a NMC on a 10+1, and my return fire does nothing.

Next turn, he moves away to try to take back some empty buildings in the rear. I rush him, and his DF does nothing. We call the game before we can resolve the upcoming CC.

End game, I am going for exit, but with two turns left, if I keep all the buildings I have, and exit everybody in the area, I will have 79 points. I need 99 for the win. Chances are, I will end up with less than that - Walt still had a HIP T-34, which he said he was going to use to take out the abandoned PzKw IV. Depending on how the CC at the far end of the board went, I could lose additional CVPs and/or buildings. And he could probably take back at least one building rushing from the factory. I only had a HS and 8-0 in the area.

Really bad pic of the board at the end of G6, before Advance Phase.



Think that this is very, very tough on the Germans. It could have been worse - he converted all his mines to AT mines, which luckily, I never hit. He could have done better placement with the HIP T-34s, to get side shots instead of front shots. I lost 2 squads, 2 tanks, had 1 Tiger immobilized, and 1 PzKw IV immobilized and abandoned. But there was no way I was going to take the fortified factory filled with Fanatic squads. I did break and ELR a number of squads in it, but they can just rout to interior hexes and rally. He lost 1 HS in the factory.

12-3 on ROAR.

 

[xenovin]

I wonder what JR would do? After antique shopping of course.

 

[jrv]

I am a bit suspicious of what appears to be the 45LL in the picture. It is in hex 49D6, which is an orchard-paved road hex. Because it is a paved road hex, the ATG may not set up there emplaced, and as it may not set up emplaced, it may not set up there HIP. Of course it may have set up on board, or it may have been pushed there, but I am going to guess it was illegally set up HIP there. That is probably a small point in this scenario.

One stack of 3x6-5-8, 2xMMG, 1xHMG, 1x9-2 on first level of 49H9 or J9. Two stacks of 2x6-5-8, 2xLMG, 1x9-1 on ground level of 49h7 & g7. That's a 35 FP up 2 attack and a 36 FP up 3 attack from each. Fire support with tanks once the ATGs have been located and neutralized if necessary. Clear the front three hexes of the factory then charge in across the road, which can only be mined by visible AT mines. Of course the building hexes themselves can be mined. Find and kill the T34 M41s; that's fourteen points if you get both crews

To me it looks pretty tough for the Germans, especially with all those mines. If both sappers clear together they clear on a 9, so that's something. If you are prepared for siege warfare you might have a chance. You also have to bug-hunt the two HIP Soviet MMCs, presumably the two OB-given halfsquads, and the T-34s and possibly for the ATGs. That's probably three squads out beating the bushes on the first few turns. It's hard to judge whether it is in fact hard or just looks that way without playing it. At eight turns it is a long scenario. Perhaps use a catapult to launch plague-infected bodies into the factory.

JR

 

[jrv]

Looking at the analysis in dispatches it looks as though the designer was expecting a more conventional, spread-out defense. Is the "all the eggs in one basket" defense going to do better? I am not sure.

JR

 

[hayman]

was expecting a more conventional, spread-out defense

Given the first picture of this AAR, it doesn't appear likely that the defense would be 'conventional' but possibly 'spread out'.

 

[jrv]

Given the first picture of this AAR, it doesn't appear likely that the defense would be 'conventional' but possibly 'spread out'.

Yes, there is evidence of fighting outside the factory Alamo. My impression from the analysis is that the expected defense would have perhaps (making a guess here) four squads in the factory and the rest of the defense (the remainder being thirteen squads plus two half squads) on the way there. If the Soviets put thirteen squads in/around the factory, the four squads outside might cost the Germans one-two turns before they can begin the assault in earnest plus it will prevent them from driving their infantry up as riders. Add to that the two-three turns it will take the Germans to physically reach the assault positions on the factory, and that leaves a very short time to dig out fanatic troops from a multi-hex fortified building. Or at least cause the Soviets a lot of casualties. The two halfsquads are HIP in non-obvious places but where they can take back multi-hex buildings so the German has to bug-hunt them.

Some other things that the Soviet might consider: disable your T34 MAs. They are recalled. That's thirty CVP that are never going to be given to the German. You might leave the M41s around for several turns to guard against German exit, in particular that Marder. But if you take the chance to kill the Marder and get killed in return, you might as well recall your T34 for guaranteed unearnable points (as opposed to risky points for attempting to kill a Marder) and let the Marder exit. Your net score is the same. Of course it's even better if you kill the Marder and recall/exit your own tank too.

Perhaps the Soviets don't set up their HIP. Instead they recombine the two halfsquads, leaving the German to think he has to bug-hunt the map for them. There are a lot of soviet leaders if you are going to set up primarily in the factory. Two 8-0s manning a 50mm MTR in an annoying place? Or a MMG? 49AA5 in a trench?

Assume the Germans take and hold all the buildings except the factory (twenty-one points) and kill, say, fifteen points of Soviets outside the factory. If the Soviets recall all their own T34s, that leaves the Germans needing sixty-three points from their eighty-two EVP and fifty-one Soviet CVP if they suffer *no* CVP of their own.

The Soviets probably need to set a few units outside the factory to guard against exiting Germans, but if they set up near the board edge behind the factory that should be good enough. Or perhaps run a line of trenches out from the factory to 49B7?

Not that they need any help, but why don't the Soviets have any ATRs?

The more I look at this, the more the Soviets look like they can limit the German's ability to score enough points in time.

JR

 

[Major Issues]

?‍

I am a bit suspicious of what appears to be the 45LL in the picture. It is in hex 49D6, which is an orchard-paved road hex. Because it is a paved road hex, the ATG may not set up there emplaced, and as it may not set up emplaced, it may not set up there HIP. Of course it may have set up on board, or it may have been pushed there, but I am going to guess it was illegally set up HIP there. That is probably a small point in this scenario.

One stack of 3x6-5-8, 2xMMG, 1xHMG, 1x9-2 on first level of 49H9 or J9. Two stacks of 2x6-5-8, 2xLMG, 1x9-1 on ground level of 49h7 & g7. That's a 35 FP up 2 attack and a 36 FP up 3 attack from each. Fire support with tanks once the ATGs have been located and neutralized if necessary. Clear the front three hexes of the factory then charge in across the road, which can only be mined by visible AT mines. Of course the building hexes themselves can be mined. Find and kill the T34 M41s; that's fourteen points if you get both crews

To me it looks pretty tough for the Germans, especially with all those mines. If both sappers clear together they clear on a 9, so that's something. If you are prepared for siege warfare you might have a chance. You also have to bug-hunt the two HIP Soviet MMCs, presumably the two OB-given halfsquads, and the T-34s and possibly for the ATGs. That's probably three squads out beating the bushes on the first few turns. It's hard to judge whether it is in fact hard or just looks that way without playing it. At eight turns it is a long scenario. Perhaps use a catapult to launch plague-infected bodies into the factory.

JR

Yes, the AT gun was set up HIP illegally. You know what a blatant cheater Walt is...

I did get some fire groups set up to fire into the factory, including the 9-2 with 3 squads with LMGs. But, darn the luck, my opponents keep insisting on being allowed to shoot back. Return fire broke the 9-2 and one of his squads, two other squads with the 9-1 broke. After they came back, I stopped trying. Too many bodies in the factory. Even though I had broken and ELR'ed a couple, they could rout back to safety in the center of the factory, and taking out Fanatics in a Fortified factory will take a lot of time and bodies.

8 turns seems like a lot, but no one would have been able to exit prior to turn 7, with the others on turn 8. Ground snow slows up everything crossing the gully. The red 12 MPs on the Tigers are not what you want for speed.

Walt had two T-34s hidden in the gully. He tried to DI my Tigers when they moved adjacent. I think he would have been better off not pulling the trigger so soon, and hoping to get a side shot or a Marter shot or an infantry shot with them. He did keep the last T-34 HIP behind the factory, and was going to pull it out to kill off the abandoned PzKw IV.

Rather than deliberately recall the T-34s, better HIP spots to nail the lighter armor would help. Even if you trade tanks, every German tank nailed is less exit points, so the Soviets are still on the upside.

To be truly evil, plunk some in the factory...

While your last suggestion is intended to be helpful, I do not own any Plague-Infected Bodies counters. Perhaps some third party will make these. And imagine the fun playing a Red October scenario where the Soviets get Plague-Infected Body Projectors... ?‍?‍

As the SS player, I would like to see them also made in black, of course...

 

[mi80j]

I took some time off from taking naked selfies to play The Backhand Blow with Walt Harrar.

View attachment 7676
"Playing ASL with that loser all day???
Even though I TOLD you we were going antique shopping?!!!"

Kharkov 1943. Combo of city and open terrain. The SS get points for CVPs, exit, multi-hex buildings, and style. Soviet CVPs are subtracted. The Soviets get a fortified factory with everyone in it Fanatic, 2 HIP guns, 2 HIP squads, Molotovs, 4 HIP T-34s, and some mines. SS get 13 squads and 7 AFVs, including 3 Tigers.

Walt chose not to defend most of the board, giving up most of the multi-hex buildings and concentrating his defense in the fortified factory.
View attachment 7678

My SS were crushin' it the first couple turns. A HS with a 50 MTR broke it on his first shot, his 57L AT tried to DI a Tiger, missed, then broke on a shot at a squad at one hex range. His two HIP squads and a 8-0 shot at my killer stack of a 9-2 and 3 squads in woods at 1 hex range. He broke one squad, but return fire (36-1!!!) broke and ELRed all three of his units. On the minus side, a HIP T-34 immobilized a PzKw IV at one hex range, then murdered the crew when they decided to come out instead of waiting for AAA.

I take out the T-34 and the gun crew. Moving the Tigers up, I find two T-34s hiding in the gully, who try for DI and miss. My PzKw III and PzKw IV move behind a wall so they can shoot into the factory. Unfortunately, this puts them in LOS of his 45LL AT gun,

View attachment 7680

who takes them both out, maintains ROF, and turns to work on one Tiger. Continues keeping ROF, and after 3 shots, immobilizes it. Shoots about another 7 times hoping for a CH. I am not exaggerating.

My Tigers Advancing Fire at his adjacent T-34s. Two hits, one burns, the other shot bounces. From a Tiger. At one hex range. With a 10-2 AL. Heavy Sigh.

I shoot up his guys across the street from the factory. Return fire from the factory breaks a couple of my squads and the 9-2. I decide that taking on the factory ain't gonna happen.

Meanwhile, at the other end of the board, a squad and HS surround his broken formerly HIP units to eliminate them for failure to rout. But his sniper breaks my HS. My 658 shoots and eliminates his HS, but the others get away. Before I can ruin their day, they rally, and try to CC my 658 with a 7-0 and a 527. We end up in Melee.

Next turn, he rolls a 12 on his CC attack, and I decide to withdraw. His Prep, I pass a NMC on a 10+1, and my return fire does nothing.

Next turn, he moves away to try to take back some empty buildings in the rear. I rush him, and his DF does nothing. We call the game before we can resolve the upcoming CC.

End game, I am going for exit, but with two turns left, if I keep all the buildings I have, and exit everybody in the area, I will have 79 points. I need 99 for the win. Chances are, I will end up with less than that - Walt still had a HIP T-34, which he said he was going to use to take out the abandoned PzKw IV. Depending on how the CC at the far end of the board went, I could lose additional CVPs and/or buildings. And he could probably take back at least one building rushing from the factory. I only had a HS and 8-0 in the area.

Really bad pic of the board at the end of G6, before Advance Phase.

View attachment 7681

Think that this is very, very tough on the Germans. It could have been worse - he converted all his mines to AT mines, which luckily, I never hit. He could have done better placement with the HIP T-34s, to get side shots instead of front shots. I lost 2 squads, 2 tanks, had 1 Tiger immobilized, and 1 PzKw IV immobilized and abandoned. But there was no way I was going to take the fortified factory filled with Fanatic squads. I did break and ELR a number of squads in it, but they can just rout to interior hexes and rally. He lost 1 HS in the factory.

12-3 on ROAR.

Dude...seriously?
This is too funny, and you are THE man!
If you keep this up, I am going to suggest that your AARs be collected and published in a volume.

 

[jrv]

?‍
Yes, the AT gun was set up HIP illegally. You know what a blatant cheater Walt is...

Can it be called "blatant" when it's done with HIP? I need an English expert; where's @klasmalmstrom?

I don't want this to sound like I'm optimistic. This is a post-mortem I'm just seeing what I can see. One of the reasons I chose 49J9 is that it's five hexes away from the factory. That prevents the 6-2-8s from firing at all and halves the 4-4-7s. I was thinking with the six tanks (ignore the Marder) plus a couple of thirty-six-ish FP firegroups blazing away you could get into the factory. But with fortified building and mines, it's not going to be quick or easy. The problem is not so much that the Germans can't eventually get into the building as they can't get in quickly, at least partly because it will take them at least two turns two turns to move up if there is zero opposition outside the factory. Throw in some light opposition to keep riders off tanks and you're looking at least turn three before the siege begins, and possibly turn four. The Soviets have the HMG and some 6-2-8s in that center building hex to punch some Germans back as they enter, unless they Smoke the building edge in which case the Germans will have blinded themselves too.

The other German option, exit, is probably a non-starter too. Perhaps an outwork of three trenches in 49A3, 49A4 & 49B3 with some squads, a MMG and a HIP T34 IN the trench in 49A4. The 57LL in 49B7, covering that outerwork as well as the road side of the factory. You might also put trenches 49A1-A5 with some units to dismount riders and cause some bog checks on vehicles.

You can't set up any of the T34s in the factory. Drive one in? It's awfully crowded already and wouldn't you breach the fortified buildings? Perhaps drive one to 49D9 then HIP the 45LL for ambush (23C1?).

The more I look at this the more depressing it is. Unless of course you want the Germans to lose, as I think we all do.

JR

 

['Ol Fezziwig]

I really have an issue with disabling the T34s. It seems to fly in the face of the purpose of a friendly game. JMHO.

 

[vonTrotta]

Does anybody have a phone number for the girl in the first picture?

 

[klasmalmstrom]

I really have an issue with disabling the T34s. It seems to fly in the face of the purpose of a friendly game. JMHO.

I don't think it should be allowed at all...regardless of whether it is a friendly game or not....

 

[Ganjulama]

Does anybody have a phone number for the girl in the first picture?

That's Major Issue's wife.

 

[JR Brackin]

That's Major Issue's wife.

You do not want to mess with Major issue's wife

 

[boylermaker]

I really have an issue with disabling the T34s. It seems to fly in the face of the purpose of a friendly game. JMHO.

My experience with this scenario is that knowingly choosing it flies in the face of the purpose of a friendly game. Your mileage may vary, but I'm not aware of anyone else's that ever has.

 

[jrv]

I really have an issue with disabling the T34s. It seems to fly in the face of the purpose of a friendly game. JMHO.

A "friendly" game. There is no such thing. You're probably one of those players that doesn't fire at Open Ground for fear of hitting cardboard livestock. You're probably one of those players that thinks that the only combat that should be allowed is with elder squirts charged with rose water (on the ESCWRW table; I am working on the IESCWRW table now). This is war, dammit.

One of the things I look for when playtesting a scenario. In this case Mr. Issues has shown that recalling may not be the best strategy if you can get an even exchange and assuming the Germans can exit that exchange if you do not make it. Assuming you can get an even exchange, if the Soviets recall their own tank, the Germans gain the full EVP of their would-have-been-exchanged tank. If the Soviets exchange, the Germans lose the CVP of their own tank and gain the CVP of the Soviet tank, meaning at best a slight gain for the Germans. Effectively killing a German tank counts for double VP.

JR

 

[Jazz]

Does anybody have a phone number for the girl in the first picture?

I'm, thinkin' she's more a "woman" than a "girl'.....

 

[Major Issues]

You do not want to mess with Major issue's wife

She is a lawyer and an expert pistol shot.

I call her "Sir."

 

[Major Issues]

A "friendly" game. There is no such thing. You're probably one of those players that doesn't fire at Open Ground for fear of hitting cardboard livestock. You're probably one of those players that thinks that the only combat that should be allowed is with elder squirts charged with rose water (on the ESCWRW table; I am working on the IESCWRW table now). This is war, dammit.

One of the things I look for when playtesting a scenario. In this case Mr. Issues has shown that recalling may not be the best strategy if you can get an even exchange and assuming the Germans can exit that exchange if you do not make it. Assuming you can get an even exchange, if the Soviets recall their own tank, the Germans gain the full EVP of their would-have-been-exchanged tank. If the Soviets exchange, the Germans lose the CVP of their own tank and gain the CVP of the Soviet tank, meaning at best a slight gain for the Germans. Effectively killing a German tank counts for double VP.

JR

I'm not a fan of scenarios where a certain setup or move will seriously tip the balance toward one side. Exiting the T-34s would do this, but you could also try to keep them HIP, so as not to lose CVPs. Even better, you can bring two of them in as reinforcements, on the turn of your choosing. So have them enter on turn 7 halfway down the board, keep them in Motion, and they are safe from destruction. I already mentioned putting them in the factory. They can't set up there, but they can move in there, and since it's fortified, they would get a +4 TEM to TH rolls. They might Bog, but you wouldn't care.

Walt correctly figured that if he piled huge bunches of Fanatic guys in a fortified factory that I would not be able to get them. Did this count as cardboard sleaze? No. Did it seriously affect the Cosmic Balance in the Universe and make it very hard for the Germans to win? Yes.

A Sleaze Move is one your opponent does that you wish you had thought of first.

I have played JR innumerable times over the years and we have always had a friendly game, even with all of his sleaze moves. 'Cause we wuz brought up right.

 

[jrv]

I'm not a fan of scenarios where a certain setup or move will seriously tip the balance toward one side. Exiting the T-34s would do this, but you could also try to keep them HIP, so as not to lose CVPs. Even better, you can bring two of them in as reinforcements, on the turn of your choosing. So have them enter on turn 7 halfway down the board, keep them in Motion, and they are safe from destruction.

In the playtest where I invented the "drive on, disable your MA, recall off and don't become CVP for marauding Tigers" sleaze, I actually didn't use it. Instead I drove hell-for-leather past the Tigers (which were not positioned for such a crazy move) and ran into the backfield In Motion. In the scenario here it's actually worse because the Soviets can enter, as you say, half way up the board. Any tank that chases after the T-34s when they enter late is not exiting.

I also thought about dismounting the crew to take back buildings. If you drive into one of the buildings and abandon, the Germans can drive a tank back to try to kill the now-abandoned shell but that's a German tank that isn't exiting if you time it right. You could set up one to abandon (use ESB in 49W9/X9 to try to get to 49W9/49W10, which is awkward for the Germans to get into position to attack). If the ESB fails, set the other T-34 to cover. If the Germans come after the covering T-34 too or instead, it goes into Motion. There are so many crazy things you could do in this scenario.

I already mentioned putting them in the factory. They can't set up there, but they can move in there, and since it's fortified, they would get a +4 TEM to TH rolls. They might Bog, but you wouldn't care.

They might rubble a hex if they don't drive in through the vehicular-sized entrance. And I can't figure out if they will cause breaches if they drive in through the vehicular entrance. The would only get +4 TEM from outside. If a Tiger poked its nose into the factory they will be less protected than +4.

JR