AAR - Ma Deuce Delivers - WO31

Major Issues

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Played this at WO against John Meyers. He had the Germans, I had the Americans.

Americans have a small infantry force with a MMG, a 9-2 and two M51 meatchoppers.

thP69X4X4I.jpg

They get 4 M10s as reinforcements. The Germans have a lot of infantry, and get three King Tigers as reinforcements.

king tigerthGUAAUWAJsm.jpg

VC are to wipe out all infantry adjacent to the road that parallels the west edge, or control all buildings adjacent to the road. If the American loses more M10s than the Germans lose King Tigers, it reduces the number of buildings needed. Because, as you well know, they are evenly matched.

German entry area is pretty terrible, with a lot of open ground and grain if they are going to do more than assault move. There is a LV hindrance to help them the first two turns.

I set up most of my infantry in the upfront buildings to get shots as the Germans entered. A lot of his infantry broke the first turn. A 6+2 shot on his concealed MG kill stack broke everyone. The next turn, another 6+2 to DM them reduced both squads, and a third shot eliminated them, leaving him just a broken 8-1 in the hex.

His tanks started blasting away when they came in, and 1-1/2 squads and my 8-0 broke. A platoon he snuck through the woods on my right eliminated a 666 in CC.

When my M10s entered, I planned to commit two of them to taking side shots at one tank. The first one hit and killed it, so all three others went to engage his infantry on the right. Most of his other infantry was broken.

One King Tiger had gone CE and parked adjacent to my stone building, but with the CA the other direction. I couldn't pass up the chance to AM adjacent with the 9-2 and two 667s. He turns and shoots, misses, but keeps rate. Second shot hits, effects roll is snakes - 2 KIA! 9-2 and one squad die, along with their chance for cardboard glory. The second squad is broken.

A 346 HS and my M10s shoot up all his infantry on the right.

In the center, he finally gets some infantry into the buildings. One squad gets broken by a meatchopper, but MG fire from one tank breaks the crew. Better camouflage might have helped.

m45 th5MBG5KOT.jpg

One M10 goes charging around to DM all his broken infantry on the right. The other two go Tiger hunting. I get one hit, but it bounces. I lose both M10s the next turn, but he did prep his lead squad and 8-0 while looking for PFs. This kept them from moving, so it wasn't all bad.

John conceded at the end of turn 4. He had only two squads left that could try and take buildings, and while I didn't have much infantry left, it was enough. I also had a 346 and a still-HIP meatchopper in the woods on my right, which he would not have been able to take out to get the road control VC.

Neither one of us had a high opinion of this. With only 5-1/2 turns, the German infantry has to keep pushing forward, while a 9-2 is blasting away at them. I don't like that the Americans can win just by keeping one or both M51s HIP. That was part of my plan with the one setup on the right, but his infantry was so decimated that I never had a shot anyway. The Germans don't have the time for a bug hunt.

My shooting was better than average in the beginning, but his snakes vs. the 9-2 evened that score. I would have needed a 9 to hurt his King Tiger in CC with the 9-2 and one squad.

An interesting setup for the Americans might be to set up a picket line of HSs in woods hexes along the east board edge. (They are allowed to set up anywhere.) If the Germans try to run past them, they get 6-1 shots. If the Germans wait and advance onto them, they might die, but they will still have held the German first turn move to 1 hex. If they figure that they are dummies and move into the hex, the Germans get bounced back to offboard. I'm not clear what would happen then. My assumption is that the bounced Germans would be allowed to advance onto the board. Throw one or two dummy stacks into the mix, and the Germans have hard choices for their entry.
 

jrv

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If they figure that they are dummies and move into the hex, the Germans get bounced back to offboard. I'm not clear what would happen then. My assumption is that the bounced Germans would be allowed to advance onto the board.
They would bounce back offboard but would strip concealment both on themselves and on a randomly selected defender unit. They could advance in the APh. Use a halfsquad to strip concealment on a single unit, then Advance in with a concealed unit if there is concealment terrain.

edit: it need not be concealment terrain to avoid losing concealment in the APh, just not open ground.

JR
 
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Perry

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The Americans cannot "win just by keeping one or both M51s HIP."

As you say, they can win just by Controlling all the road-adjacent buildings (minus any excess of AFV eliminated).

Sorry you didn't like it.
 

Ray Woloszyn

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I think this scenario can be played many ways. As I walked around W.O. and saw the games in progress it seems that an upfront block of the German infantry generally led to a disaster later (as I experienced). Sure, it's nice to shoot up the German infantry coming in but you need all your squads to hunker down in the center building complex at game end and not get caught behind the ever advancing German line. The meat choppers will keep the Germans from stacking or risking their better leaders cautious the longer they remain hidden. This will be on the Bitter Ender's main tournament playlist.
 

Major Issues

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The Americans cannot "win just by keeping one or both M51s HIP."

As you say, they can win just by Controlling all the road-adjacent buildings (minus any excess of AFV eliminated).

Sorry you didn't like it.
Should have been clearer. They can't win with a HIP gun, but it does take away one of the two potential victory conditions.
 

Cult.44

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I think this scenario can be played many ways. As I walked around W.O. and saw the games in progress it seems that an upfront block of the German infantry generally led to a disaster later (as I experienced). Sure, it's nice to shoot up the German infantry coming in but you need all your squads to hunker down in the center building complex at game end and not get caught behind the ever advancing German line. The meat choppers will keep the Germans from stacking or risking their better leaders cautious the longer they remain hidden. This will be on the Bitter Ender's main tournament playlist.
Agree. I looked at this and didn't think the Americans should put more than token resistance up front. Let the Germans come to the meat choppers and protect them with bazookas. Even a nicely spread out German advance could get shot up if an M51 keeps rate a few times and "trims the verge," so to speak. I think the Germans would need to neutralize at least one of them pretty early to have a chance.
 

wrongway149

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I should have been clearer. They can't win with a HIP gun, but it does take away one of the two potential victory conditions.
That's exactly why there are TWO victory conditions. :)

Is keeping your best assets out of the fight still an advantage to the US player?
 

wrongway149

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I think this scenario can be played many ways. As I walked around W.O. and saw the games in progress it seems that an upfront block of the German infantry generally led to a disaster later (as I experienced). Sure, it's nice to shoot up the German infantry coming in but you need all your squads to hunker down in the center building complex at game end and not get caught behind the ever advancing German line. The meat choppers will keep the Germans from stacking or risking their better leaders cautious the longer they remain hidden. This will be on the Bitter Ender's main tournament playlist.
So far it is recorded as 4-4 on ROAR, so I'm OK with it.
 

etopp

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My ASL group has played this four times without a German win. Any tips?
 

Mister T

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It is an interesting scenario. I understand it is challenging but not convinced as to claims regarding its imbalance level. On the play list for sure
 

Matt Book

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My ASL group has played this four times without a German win. Any tips?
Have the King Tiger Crews clean the pollen off the optics sights before launching the attack
 

davegin

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My comments on this scenario can be viewed in the St. Louis Tourney thread. I agree that it is pro American. I would rate it 70/30.
 

Eagle4ty

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My comments on this scenario can be viewed in the St. Louis Tourney thread. I agree that it is pro American. I would rate it 70/30.
WOW, didn't play out that way at the Chicago Open (I believe it was a 2-2 split), but do believe it is slightly pro-American but not as much as you indicate. If the Germans make hay early, it'll be hard for the Americas to hold out as the King-Kitties are almost invulnerable if they are able to protect one-another. The Amerricans are simply stretched too thin to preclude a concerted German assault if pressed with sufficient vigor. The German balance certainly makes it an almost even or slightly pro-German affair.
 

davegin

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WOW, didn't play out that way at the Chicago Open (I believe it was a 2-2 split), but do believe it is slightly pro-American but not as much as you indicate. If the Germans make hay early, it'll be hard for the Americas to hold out as the King-Kitties are almost invulnerable if they are able to protect one-another. The Amerricans are simply stretched too thin to preclude a concerted German assault if pressed with sufficient vigor. The German balance certainly makes it an almost even or slightly pro-German affair.
In the two American wins in Chicago: the US player gakked the setup in the one and in the other the US player foolishly tried to pick off the tigers and lost his vehicles reducing the building requirements by four. I wouldn't consider these to be "acceptable" German wins.
 
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