A7.9 Cowering & Leader Direction

Seabee Mark

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Fire Direction & Leadership DRM.

I’ve always thought these were pretty much the same: That a leader could only direct the fire of units that shared his Location, and if there was a multi-hex FG the leader was pretty much useless except for keeping the units he was stacked with from cowering.

A reread of A7.5, A7.53, A7.531, & A7.9 makes me think I’ve gotten this wrong these many years, and that a leader can keep a multi-hex FG from cowering, even if the leadership DRM can’t be used.

A7.5 (Fire Group) defines a FG pretty clearly, and even states it could be “composed of a virtually unlimited string of ADJACENT Locations”.

A7.53 (Fire Direction) says a single leader can’t “direct more than one weapon/unit unless part of the same FG.” No mention of leadership DRM here but apparently a leader can direct a “virtually unlimited” FG.

A7.531 addresses leadership DRM, saying it can modify a FG only if all firing units are in the same Location. Very black & white that leadership DRM can’t be used in one of those “virtually unlimited” FGs.

A7.9 (Cowering) says cowering doesn’t occur when “a leader directs that attack.” Since leadership direction applies to a FG, a leader can keep a “virtually unlimited” number of units from cowering - even if the leader’s DRM can’t be used.

:( Am I missing something now or have I simply been playing this wrong since the dawn of time?

Thanks & Roll low,
Mark
 

Commissar Piotr

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Hi Girls

To safeguard against Cowering with a leader is to modify that attack and so it is not allowed.
Also note that you cannot differentiate if the Leader is a "-0" Leader. He uses his Leadership value but do not affect the DR, is he directing or using his DRM ?

There is also a Q&A to this effect:

"A7.53-.531 & A10.72 These seem to imply that leader direction and the application of a leader's DRM can be declared independently of each other. Is this true?

A. No--the two are synonymous in all cases. However, if leader direction is used for an attack/action to whose DR/dr "triangle" applies, that leader's DRM/drm cannot apply to that DR/dr. {96}"
 
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Reepicheep

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Well it was a nice try anyway, Mark. If you'd tried that argument on me "live" and we had been playing face-to-face and without the benefit of Commisar Piotr's Official Q&A Clarifications, I might have taken the bait! :D
 

Seabee Mark

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Peter,

Thanks for the Q&A – I knew there must be something out there.

So if you use Leadership Fire Direction you have to use Leadership DRM if you can. For example, an attack affected by a ‘triangle’ – say a FT attack – can be directed by a leader so that the firer doesn’t cower, but any Leadership DRM can’t apply since the FT is a ‘triangle’ weapon. Makes sense, and I’ve always played this way.

Perhaps I’m splitting hairs, but a multi-Location FG is tantamount to an attack affected by a ‘triangle’, i.e., Leadership Fire Direction can apply to the entire FG, but the Leadership DRM can not. This means that every unit in the multi-Location FG is kept from cowering, not just the units that are in the Leader’s Location.

The Q&A you cited makes me more certain that I have been playing it wrong. Maybe this is a “no brainer” to most, but I’m on the verge of having one of those “ASLRB epiphanies": that a Leader can protect an entire multi-hex FG from Cowering!

Roll low,
Mark
 

Commissar Piotr

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Hi Girls

This is the rule we are talking about:

7.531 A leader may use his leadership DRM (10.7) to modify the IFT DR of any one attacking unit or FG per Player Turn, provided all firing units of the FG are in the same Location. A leadership DRM may be employed with a multihex/Location FG only if a leader directing that attack is present in every Location; the leadership DRM in effect is that of the lowestquality participating leader. A Leader affects the To Hit DR of an ordnance SW—not the effects of those hits on the IFT or AFV To Kill Table, nor the chance of a weapon malfunction. A Leader directing fire is treated as if he were firing.

According to COWTRA, the rule do not allow you to direct a Multi-Loation FG with one exception, if you have a Leader in each separate Location, and in that case you use the highest DRM in any of the Locations. The Q&A I referred to also says that the Leader DRM and Leader Direction is the same thing.
It is not possible to safeguard against Cowering with a lone Leader for a Multi-Location FG.

Geez, how hard can it be... :p
 

alanp

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Mark,

where's the triangle for PF, D1/FF, AF? being "tantamount to a triangle attack" isn't BEING a triangle attack. The leader drm is the same thing as the 'direction' which prevents cowering.

I know you're still thinking about this(based on our phone converstation ;) )and you're looking for a 'friendly' reply. Well, here you are. . .

Alan
 

ToxicShock

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On a slightly different tangent, I have a heroic leader 9-1 with 3 747s that attack with their IFP for 15FP. The attack is a snake-eyes (1,1). Does the leader prevent cowering even though he is heroic and used his FP?
I went through the rules a few times and keep getting hung up on the 2nd last line of A15.24 which says: "A hero's participation does not exempt other members of a FG from cowering."
So which case applies?
 
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Commissar Piotr

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Hi Girls and Mark

I am sincerely sorry if you thought my post was not friendly. That was not my intention, therefore the smiley.

ToxicShock, not at my own computer at the mnoment but I know that if a Heroic Leader uses his Hero DRM he cannot also direct the attack. Reason for this is that directing a attack is considered as attacking and a Leader cannot both fire himself and direct fire so the attack you mention will cower, note that the Heroic Leader do not cower himself though.
I asked this question myself some time ago and asked about it. IIRC it was Perry that answered this issue to the effect I am outlining above.
 

ToxicShock

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Commissar Piotr said:
ToxicShock, not at my own computer at the mnoment but I know that if a Heroic Leader uses his Hero DRM he cannot also direct the attack. Reason for this is that directing a attack is considered as attacking and a Leader cannot both fire himself and direct fire so the attack you mention will cower, note that the Heroic Leader do not cower himself though.
I asked this question myself some time ago and asked about it. IIRC it was Perry that answered this issue to the effect I am outlining above.
I recall a debate about this topic on some of the other lists. I just needed to refresh my memory. Thanks Piotr.
 

alanp

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Commissar Piotr said:
Hi Girls and Mark
See, Mark, I told you Piotr wasn't calling you a 'girl' ;)

I assume he's just being the friendly drill sergeant, like in "Full Metal Jacket". . .

Alan
 
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