A11.15 Units locked in CC/Melee

[Corporal Kindel]

Had this situation come up late last night in a FTF game, and I wasn't 100% sure if we resolved it correctly (I normally don't spend time looking up vaguely recalled rules in FTF games, instead I just pretty much go by memory). In Soldiers of Destruction, I had a T34/85 in motion bypass of a single story house. ADJACENT to this hex is a berserk 628 from an earlier HOB result. It is the German Advance phase, he decides to advance an 8-1 leader & 658+LMG squad into the single story house after passing a PAATC for the squad. In the ensuing CCph we both fail our respective CC attacks (he rolls a 6 for an ATM check and pins his squad thus adding +1 to his CC DR). Now, what follows is what I wasn't 100% about: since the AFV is in motion it can't hold the infantry unit in Melee as per A11.15 v2:

"... Infantry are also held in Melee by enemy Cavalry, cyclists, and non-Abandoned, Stopped, "unbroken" (12.1) vehicles ..."

And since a vehicle is never held in Melee as per A11.7:

"VEHICLE WITHDRAWAL FROM CC: A vehicle is never held in Melee ..."

I'm assuming that no Melee counter would have been placed (only the CC counter left in place) since none of the units were locked in Melee, even though the CCph ended, correct?

Now in the next player turn (the Russian's) the Berserk 6-2-8 has to move first and charges the closest KEU (the German squad LMG & Leader now in CC in the ADJACENT single story house). They charge into the house & the Germans must shoot a 24 IFP even (-1 leader, -1 FFNAM, +2 wood bldg) TPBF DFF shot followed by a 12 even SFF shot; the Germans are not locked in Melee only CC, so they are able to shoot thusly correct?

A last question we had was that, since board #6 was used, the stone/wooden colors were ambiguous. I vaguely remembered reading a reference to this somewhere, but I couldn't remember if it was in the rules or in a QA somewhere, so we made a spot-house-rule that multi-story buildings were stone, others were wooden. Is this correct, does anyone remember the rule/QA reference for this in respect to this particular board?

Thanks guys,
rk

 

[Ole Boe]

"... Infantry are also held in Melee by enemy Cavalry, cyclists, and non-Abandoned, Stopped, "unbroken" (12.1) vehicles ..."

And since a vehicle is never held in Melee as per A11.7:

"VEHICLE WITHDRAWAL FROM CC: A vehicle is never held in Melee ..."

I'm assuming that no Melee counter would have been placed (only the CC counter left in place) since none of the units were locked in Melee, even though the CCph ended, correct?

Correct, except that I'm unsure of why you leave the CC counter in place. It is color-coded to be automatically removed at the end of the CCPh.

I've never really understood the use of a CC counter though :hmmm:

Now in the next player turn (the Russian's) the Berserk 6-2-8 has to move first and charges the closest KEU (the German squad LMG & Leader now in CC in the ADJACENT single story house). They charge into the house & the Germans must shoot a 24 IFP even (-1 leader, -1 FFNAM, +2 wood bldg) TPBF DFF shot followed by a 12 even SFF shot; the Germans are not locked in Melee only CC, so they are able to shoot thusly correct?

That sounds correct. They only had to fire once, but firing the second, 12 even shot, may usually be a good idea too.

A last question we had was that, since board #6 was used, the stone/wooden colors were ambiguous. I vaguely remembered reading a reference to this somewhere, but I couldn't remember if it was in the rules or in a QA somewhere, so we made a spot-house-rule that multi-story buildings were stone, others were wooden. Is this correct, does anyone remember the rule/QA reference for this in respect to this particular board?

I'm not aware of any specific Q&A for this board. The general rule (B23.3) says "If the color of a particular building is such that players cannot agree on the construction type of that building, treat it as wooden." though.

 

[Josh]

Correct, except that I'm unsure of why you leave the CC counter in place. It is color-coded to be automatically removed at the end of the CCPh.

I've never really understood the use of a CC counter though :hmmm:

Ole, just for clarification for a newbie here. If an AFV locks a MMC in cc and they cannot go to melee. If the cc results in no effect, what happens at the end of this turn? stay in cc until something happens? What are the options?

Thanks.

 

[Ole Boe]

Ole, just for clarification for a newbie here. If an AFV locks a MMC in cc and they cannot go to melee. If the cc results in no effect, what happens at the end of this turn? stay in cc until something happens? What are the options

If the AFV is Stopped, it locks the Infantry in Melee, but is not held in Melee itself.
In this case, the Infantry cannot do anything while locked in Melee, but the AFV may fire as normal (but is limited to fire in its own Location of course). However, as soon as the AFV expends a Start MP, it no longer locks the Infantry in Melee, so the Infantry can immediately try a Reactio Fire CC attack (or PF or whatever it can attack the AFV with) vs the Non-Stopped AFV in its own hex.

If the AFV is in Motion, neither it nor the Infantry is locked in Melee, so they can both fire and move as normal (but not fire out of its enemy-occupied Location of course).

 

[Josh]

I was afraid you would say that

thanks.

 

[Corporal Kindel]

Thanks guys,
looks like we pretty much did things correctly. I got slammed in that scenario btw, checked the ROAR afterwards, it was rated 77 Ger. to 17 Rus. I think getting 26 Russian exit points off for victory conditions is too difficult. It should be something like 15 to 18 exit CVPs, then it would be more even, maybe even 50-50 then IMO.