6.6.5 chat window issue

Tycho

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My opponent and I both have 3.6.7 & 6.6.5. He can't see any text in the chat window other than his own (we hopped in to several VASL rooms to make sure it was not just mine that he couldn't see) - it's not even picking up the carriage returns after rolling dice. I sent him a log file (just a half-dozen DRs), he could step through it but still saw no text. We did the usual turn-it-off-and-on-again and he grabbed a fresh copy of 6.6.5, no joy. We tested VASL 6.6.4, it works as expected. Any ideas?
Thanks,

Tycho
 

PresterJohn

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Under Chat Window preferences, is the text set to a colour that is visible against the background colour?
 

DougRim

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My opponent and I both have 3.6.7 & 6.6.5. He can't see any text in the chat window other than his own (we hopped in to several VASL rooms to make sure it was not just mine that he couldn't see) - it's not even picking up the carriage returns after rolling dice. I sent him a log file (just a half-dozen DRs), he could step through it but still saw no text. We did the usual turn-it-off-and-on-again and he grabbed a fresh copy of 6.6.5, no joy. We tested VASL 6.6.4, it works as expected. Any ideas?
Thanks,

Tycho
The font colour check is a good idea. Even if the preference shows a colour as selected, redo the selection.

Other similar but not identical problems have been solved by removing all extensions. If that solves the problem then put back your extensions one by one until you find something that caused the problem. There may be more than one.
 

Tycho

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We did play with the colors so it wasn't that. I'll have him pull the extensions, I'll bet he has tons of them. Here's hoping...
 

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Experienced the same thing. The extensions i have (under the selected extension directory) are:

5SV.mdx
5VBM.mdx
BFP_Overlays.zip
BFP_v431.vmdx
BFPv5.00.vmdx
chatter-plus-2.21.vmdx
chit-generator-2.0.vmdx
cloaking-display.vmdx
festung-budapest-1.2.vmdx
Inor.vmdx
KFW_v1.0.vmdx
LCP-Anzio44.vmdx
oba-flowchart.vmdx
onslaught-to-orsha-6.0.vmdx
SCW_DRAFT_013.vmdx
secret-dr-1.0.vmdx
sniper-finder.vmdx
terrain-chart-1.2.1.vmdx
tray.vmdx
VASLOverlays_v2.10.vmdx
 

DougRim

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@KalleW I would encourage the same approach. Remove them all and see if that fixes the problem - a very good chance it will. If it does, then you can put them back one-by-one and see which ones are causing the problem (quite possible that more than one will be the cause).

Your list of extensions is not very different from others that I see and so, as a bit of a public service announcement and not to pick on you specifically, I offer the following advice for putting them back.

1. Don't put these ones back as they are obsolete, the functionality or counters that they contain are now built into the VASL module:
5SV.mdx
chatter-plus-2.21.vmdx
KFW_v1.0.vmdx
sniper-finder.vmdx

2. Get the most recent version of these from VASL.info:
BFP_v431.vmdx - you don't need this at all as you only need one BFP counter extension
BFPv5.00.vmdx - the most recent BFP extension includes Onslaught to Orsha so you don't need to put onslaught-to-orsha-6.0.vmdx back in
BFP_Overlays.zip - I suspect this comes from the BFP site; check it for update
oba-flowchart.vmdx - most recent version is 1.1; version is displayed in chat window when loaded
VASLOverlays_v2.10.vmdx - most recent version is 2.11

3. These ones seem fine to me:
5VBM.mdx
chit-generator-2.0.vmdx
cloaking-display.vmdx
festung-budapest-1.2.vmdx
Inor.vmdx
LCP-Anzio44.vmdx
secret-dr-1.0.vmdx - unless it is causing the chat window problem which it may well be
terrain-chart-1.2.1.vmdx

4. Unknown to me
SCW_DRAFT_013.vmdx - I forget what this one is; doesn't mean it's a problem, just means I can't give you any advice on it.

Hope that is helpful
 

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@DougRim Haven't got the possibility to test more thoroughly atm. But, removing the ones mentioned in bullet 1 at least showed two separate (remote) 6.6.5 players die rolls in my chat. Trying to pinpoint which one later.
 

Honosbinda

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Significant problems with a PBEM game along these lines using 6.6.5 just discovered.

Another solution is to roll back to the old version 6.6.4 (as the OP suggested works), until the problems are identified and fixed in the new version.

These suggested 'field fixes' of extensions are fine as they go, but what's not being mentioned is that we had no problems with the previous versions of VASL all the way back to 3.1.17. All of a sudden, perhaps due to the new HTML-enabled approach for the chat box, problems with color, problems with results not printing out, and so on. Is it not more likely that the source of the problem is the new module itself -- rather than old extensions we've been playing with for years -- causing problems with the chat communication?

I don't use any of those obsolete modules and I am using BFP5.01, so not even BFP 5.00 is the most recent version, is it? I am not using units from that extension to play the scenario we are having problems with.

further from VASL info:

(2) The chat window is now html enabled in VASSAL and VASL has been updated to use that functionality. This will improve the display of VASSAL messages in particular. NOTE: If you switch back-and-forth between 6.6.5 and any earlier version you will need to reset your coloured die colour (in both the Chat Window and Dice Over the Map) each time you switch. Unfortunate, but can't be avoided.


It's making the display worse in some cases, obviously. I'm not sure what the improvement is supposed to be, anyway, I don't see much of that. Also the die color problem is pernicious. I can only get a black coloured die roll view in the chat box if I am using the dice over the map option. I've tried changing it but the dice color only seems to change in the dice over the map. It's definitely not an improvement to see only black-colored die in the chat box. Maybe I'm missing something there and it's fixable.

The font color I've chosen for opponents messages is changed to my color when doing interstitial logs in PBeM; that didn't happen before with 6.6.4 on back. Combined with the 'not showing immediately after typing a message' problem, it's become much less fun doing PBeM when the opponents messages turn to the same color as my own.

Of course, it's not as if PBeM is the most desired mode of play but a lot of people only have time for that.

(3) Ammo Depletion has been added to those Vehicles/Guns which have Special Ammo. Ammo Depletion status is shown using the “ALT+I” shortcut or via the dropdown menu’s “Deplete Ammo” submenu using the “Toggle On/Off” selection. This will bring up a label below the counter with each type of Depletable ammo available for that counter. Toggle the availability via shortcut as well as the dropdown selection in the submenu. When toggled, the Depletable Ammo selected has its label changed to red with a strikethrough. Toggling again will return status to available.

This ammo depletion does not seem to work with American Vehicles with more than one sort of depletable ammo.
 
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DougRim

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(3) Ammo Depletion has been added to those Vehicles/Guns which have Special Ammo. Ammo Depletion status is shown using the “ALT+I” shortcut or via the dropdown menu’s “Deplete Ammo” submenu using the “Toggle On/Off” selection. This will bring up a label below the counter with each type of Depletable ammo available for that counter. Toggle the availability via shortcut as well as the dropdown selection in the submenu. When toggled, the Depletable Ammo selected has its label changed to red with a strikethrough. Toggling again will return status to available.

This ammo depletion does not seem to work with American Vehicles with more than one sort of depletable ammo.
Except that it does. 23229

This is an M4A3(76)W. Drag one onto a map. Toggle Ammo Depletion ON. Click away from the vehicle so that the hex label is not covering the depletion label. Use the specific ammo type submenu of Ammo Depletion to toggle the ammo as available (black) or unavailable (red).

It is quite possible that we missed a vehicle here and there . . . there are a LOT of vehicle counters in VASL. If you find one where this is absent or not working or not showing every ammo type that it should, let me know which specific vehicle and we can fix it.
 

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Significant problems with a PBEM game along these lines using 6.6.5 just discovered.

Another solution is to roll back to the old version 6.6.4 (as the OP suggested works), until the problems are identified and fixed in the new version.

These suggested 'field fixes' of extensions are fine as they go, but what's not being mentioned is that we had no problems with the previous versions of VASL all the way back to 3.1.17. All of a sudden, perhaps due to the new HTML-enabled approach for the chat box, problems with color, problems with results not printing out, and so on. Is it not more likely that the source of the problem is the new module itself -- rather than old extensions we've been playing with for years -- causing problems with the chat communication?
No. You are not correct.

This is what has happened:

I updated the chat window in VASL to use html rather than older, less flexible tools that limited what could be done in chat.

While not without issues, that update, which was released in beta a number of months ago, has worked. No longer are VASSAL messages, especially when connecting online, containing html hieroglyphics that make reading the message more difficult. That is just one example of an improvement. The update was aimed at building a platform for the future rather than implementing specific visual changes here and now.

Over time a number of third parties have developed extensions that interacted with the chat window using the previous VASL code. It would not surprise me if some of them actually created a new chat window. These extensions no longer work with the new chat window code. In some cases the result of 'not working' is that they show duplicate windows or place buttons floating in the middle of the window.

There is no code that I can sensibly add to 6.6.5 to fix this. As you point out sticking with 6.6.4 is a perfectly legitimate way to go and the extensions will continue to work as they have.

The extensions (not every one, just those that add to or change the chat window) have to be updated to work with the new html code. Since those extensions were developed by third parties, I don't have the right or the permission to just go and change them. Nor do I know which extensions exist. There are some posted on VASL.info but by no means all. People can create an extension whenever they wish and I have no control over that (nor do I want any). I am certainly prepared to work with any extension developer to make the necessary changes.

I could not have reached out to extension owners beforehand because (a) I don't know who they are and (b) I don't know what is inside their extensions so I can't tell if they will have a problem or not.

Removing extensions is the easiest way in the short term to fix certain problems that people have been reporting. Especially since many of those extensions are now obsolete. There would be no point in updating them.

There are of course other bugs with that chat window update that have nothing to do with extensions and that need a VASL fix. And I have been commiting to do that.

. . . Also the die color problem is pernicious. I can only get a black coloured die roll view in the chat box if I am using the dice over the map option. I've tried changing it but the dice color only seems to change in the dice over the map. It's definitely not an improvement to see only black-colored die in the chat box. Maybe I'm missing something there and it's fixable.
To change the colour of the coloured die in Dice Over the Map, you use the preference in the Dice Over Map tab in the Preferences Window. To change the colour of the coloured die in the Chat Window you use the preference in the Chat Window tab in the Preferences Window. Each preference works only for it's specific die display. To change both coloured die you must change both preferences.
The font color I've chosen for opponents messages is changed to my color when doing interstitial logs in PBeM; that didn't happen before with 6.6.4 on back. Combined with the 'not showing immediately after typing a message' problem, it's become much less fun doing PBeM when the opponents messages turn to the same color as my own.

Of course, it's not as if PBeM is the most desired mode of play but a lot of people only have time for that.
I will check on the font colour issue. There was an earlier reference to a background colour issue in Dice Over Map, which is clearly a bug.
 

Honosbinda

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Except that it does. View attachment 23229

This is an M4A3(76)W. Drag one onto a map. Toggle Ammo Depletion ON. Click away from the vehicle so that the hex label is not covering the depletion label. Use the specific ammo type submenu of Ammo Depletion to toggle the ammo as available (black) or unavailable (red).

It is quite possible that we missed a vehicle here and there . . . there are a LOT of vehicle counters in VASL. If you find one where this is absent or not working or not showing every ammo type that it should, let me know which specific vehicle and we can fix it.
Really? Okay, let's play the "except it does / except it doesn't" game forum expediency, shall we?

Except that it doesn't work for all of them, since I don't make stuff like this up. I can't remember which one(s) I checked that it doesn't, sorry. Honestly I was just trying out the new feature in order to congratulate the wizards that be, but it was a fail on the VERY FIRST vehicle I checked! Didn't give me a lot of confidence going through hundreds of other counters checking the same (I've known ASL has a lot of counters for a long time, and so have you, before you decided to add this feature). What do I get for reporting this? A thank you? No. A Push-back with homework? Yes. heh. No thanks.

My mistake was mentioning this afterthought of a comment at all; you can just as well do the homework assignment or assign it to one of your team. That said, if, in the course of live gaming, I find which one(s) I was speaking of (I think at first it was a 75mm Sherman not a 76L W -- there's a clue), I'll let you know. In the meantime, you know you have a problem, you're welcome, so my duty for the hobby is done. I can still mark the vehicles with comments as usual or (gasp) use the actual 1/2 inch depleted ammo counters. I don't need the razzmatazz cleaning up a game which doesn't need cleaned up.

As you know, I'm not a big fan of this continuous addition of bells and whistles to the game to make it more and more diverse from the hex and counter version of the real game. So I don't plan to assist these sort of mutations actively. I'm forced to tolerate them when they occur.
 
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Honosbinda

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No. You are not correct.

This is what has happened:

I updated the chat window in VASL to use html rather than older, less flexible tools that limited what could be done in chat.

While not without issues, that update, which was released in beta a number of months ago, has worked. No longer are VASSAL messages, especially when connecting online, containing html hieroglyphics that make reading the message more difficult. That is just one example of an improvement. The update was aimed at building a platform for the future rather than implementing specific visual changes here and now.

Over time a number of third parties have developed extensions that interacted with the chat window using the previous VASL code. It would not surprise me if some of them actually created a new chat window. These extensions no longer work with the new chat window code. In some cases the result of 'not working' is that they show duplicate windows or place buttons floating in the middle of the window.

There is no code that I can sensibly add to 6.6.5 to fix this. As you point out sticking with 6.6.4 is a perfectly legitimate way to go and the extensions will continue to work as they have.

The extensions (not every one, just those that add to or change the chat window) have to be updated to work with the new html code. Since those extensions were developed by third parties, I don't have the right or the permission to just go and change them. Nor do I know which extensions exist. There are some posted on VASL.info but by no means all. People can create an extension whenever they wish and I have no control over that (nor do I want any). I am certainly prepared to work with any extension developer to make the necessary changes.

I could not have reached out to extension owners beforehand because (a) I don't know who they are and (b) I don't know what is inside their extensions so I can't tell if they will have a problem or not.

Removing extensions is the easiest way in the short term to fix certain problems that people have been reporting. Especially since many of those extensions are now obsolete. There would be no point in updating them.

There are of course other bugs with that chat window update that have nothing to do with extensions and that need a VASL fix. And I have been commiting to do that.


To change the colour of the coloured die in Dice Over the Map, you use the preference in the Dice Over Map tab in the Preferences Window. To change the colour of the coloured die in the Chat Window you use the preference in the Chat Window tab in the Preferences Window. Each preference works only for it's specific die display. To change both coloured die you must change both preferences.

I will check on the font colour issue. There was an earlier reference to a background colour issue in Dice Over Map, which is clearly a bug.
Thanks for checking the font color issue.

Also, I appreciate this response explaining the intricacies of coding, of which I am unaware, so not in a position to dispute the statements, nor do I desire to. I'm sure you have better things to do than 'de-improving' things by adding new and more flexible code. But, I have not asked anyone to update extensions, reach out to previous code developers, etc. No reason to, because these work fine in previous editions and only seem flawed, apparently, when using 6.5.5.

What I am in a position to support is that previous versions with extensions don't have this problem, correct? At least I never ran into them using 6.4.4 and previous versions, so no matter what is said, using 6.5.5 for PBeM is not an improvement, based on the experience I have had, with the extensions I have used, or anyone else has used.

If it's not possible to change the coding, then what might be the only solution is that I recommend to the CyberVASL group they roll everything back to 6.4.4 for PBeM games to avoid these issues.
 

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What I am in a position to support is that previous versions with extensions don't have this problem, correct?
Agreed, they have other problems but not the chat window problems that you are having.

If it's not possible to change the coding, then what might be the only solution is that I recommend to the CyberVASL group they roll everything back to 6.4.4 for PBeM games to avoid these issues.
Absolutely, using previous versions where they work better for your particular need/interest is the smart thing to do. I agree.

Of course, it means you will have to live with the problems inherent in those earlier versions. If you don't mind this kind thing, then that should not be a problem:
23230

The above is 3.6.7/6.6.4

The same in 3.6.7/6.6.5:
23231

Users should have choice and VASL users do!
 

DougRim

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As you know, I'm not a big fan of this continuous addition of bells and whistles to the game to make it more and more diverse from the hex and counter version of the real game. So I don't plan to assist these sort of mutations actively. I'm forced to tolerate them when they occur.
And the nice thing about VASL is that we can, for the most part, add functionality that users can choose not to use. The ammo depletion is a perfect example of that. You tried it and, bad luck, hit a bug right out of the gate. So you don't want to use it. Good news: you don't have to. Just ignore it and carry on playing as you always have.

A lot of VASL changes work that way: the Casualty Bin, the new +ACQ method, and the red CA marker for guns/vehicles are good examples. They are there but never need to be used.

Some changes, however, do not give users the same choice. The chat window changes that you have also commented on are not discretionary. I understand that. But sometimes it is necessary: in 6.6.5 I had to undo the labels I had added to Weather/EC counters. I loved those labels as they made sense of a bunch of conflicting and overlying counters to me. Sniff. But they had to go in order to enable work on creating a durable Game Updater function that will allow users to updater games from earlier versions to new versions without the bad stuff that happens now. The option to stick with earlier versions is there.
 

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Could the ammo depletion display be offset as to not cover the hex location below it.
 

hongkongwargamer

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@DougRim VASL continues to work wonders for me, version after version. Admittedly there are glitches here and there but never anything remotely major. I can’t believe how much we are benefiting off your work. I regret how little I contribute apart from pointing out the occasional issue or two. It’s easy to point out issues, it’s much harder to solve them. I use VASL multiple times weekly with my regular opponents.

I am sure there are better things you can do with your time. I appreciate your (and all the map/ counter folks) choosing to put that in for the ASL community.

Thank you
 
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Robin Reeve

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I can’t believe how much we are benefiting off your work. [...] I appreciate your (and all the map/ counter folks) choosing to put that in for the ASL community.
Thank you
Same here.
As I am largely incompetent in your domain, @DougRim , I measure how much I owe you for all the work of love that you deploy to improve VASL.
Without VASL, my ASL gaming would be drastically reduced.
Keep on the good work.
Thanks a lot.
 
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