1-2-7 what to do?

Robin Reeve

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The general rule could be no crew survival - the CS# only applying to Passengers and Riders.
 

Eagle4ty

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The general rule could be no crew survival - the CS# only applying to Passengers and Riders.
For CVP count I can certainly see CS as is but as said earlier, I would entail an automatic Recall of such crews that survive (no CVP penalty for those that exit the playing area) or an additional penalty to remain on-board. I often thought that was a better option for trucks and halftracks, etc. that unloaded their passengers/equipment as well, as these assets were counted on primarily to provide transport and that an option to remain in the immediate battlespace could better be handled by a designer's SSR. JMHO of course.
 

jyoung

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For CVP count I can certainly see CS as is but as said earlier, I would entail an automatic Recall of such crews that survive (no CVP penalty for those that exit the playing area) or an additional penalty to remain on-board. I often thought that was a better option for trucks and halftracks, etc. that unloaded their passengers/equipment as well, as these assets were counted on primarily to provide transport and that an option to remain in the immediate battlespace could better be handled by a designer's SSR. JMHO of course.
No!!! How am I ever going to find those mines without a truck or jeep or two to race around taking one for the team? My cardboard transport corps drivers are all steely eyed, square jawed, and utterly selfless. :D
 
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Old Noob

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My view is, if a tank crew has survived their tank being knocked out, they should go back the way they came in {keeping both ends low}.
Return to battalion HQ and requisition a new tank [after a few days R&R]. They are more useful as mobile fire support than as ersatz infantry.
Considering that there only a single SMG and a few grenades inside the tank (maybe more SMGs, depends on crew scrounging abilities).
 

Actionjick

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My view is, if a tank crew has survived their tank being knocked out, they should go back the way they came in {keeping both ends low}.
Return to battalion HQ and requisition a new tank [after a few days R&R]. They are more useful as mobile fire support than as ersatz infantry.
Considering that there only a single SMG and a few grenades inside the tank (maybe more SMGs, depends on crew scrounging abilities).
This seems logical to us but Comrade Commisar might have a different viewpoint !☹
 

bendizoid

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My view is, if a tank crew has survived their tank being knocked out, they should go back the way they came in {keeping both ends low}.
Return to battalion HQ and requisition a new tank [after a few days R&R]. They are more useful as mobile fire support than as ersatz infantry.
Considering that there only a single SMG and a few grenades inside the tank (maybe more SMGs, depends on crew scrounging abilities).
What happens if the crew gets out and they’re kinda pissed off ?
 

Actionjick

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What happens if the crew gets out and they’re kinda pissed off ?
I would think that tankers would be taught what to do when their vehicle is knocked out. This may have been brought up earlier in the thread. Was this training universal in it's approach or did each nationality have its own procedure? As the war progressed how did that training evolve? Finally is it worth it to deal with the various nationalities approach to post crew survival in ASL? How much chrome is necessary before you become blinded by the light?
 

wrongway149

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We have all seen the well known 'abandon' tactic used to get a crew into a VC building. This has become such a problem that we are seeing more and more SSRs prohibiting this particular sleaze move. The only proviso I would extend here would be in regards to dedicated recce vehicles whose role actually involved fighting dismounted. In the main, however, this abuse is considered egregious enough to merit changes. This is not a bad thing.
For example: in the recent Action pack scenario "Red Horse Recon", the common SSR about not being able to voluntarily abandon AFVs was NOT included for exactly that reason.

So if you lost as the Americans and think it's pro-German -- go back and try again!!!
 

Actionjick

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For example: in the recent Action pack scenario "Red Horse Recon", the common SSR about not being able to voluntarily abandon AFVs was NOT included for exactly that reason.

So if you lost as the Americans and think it's pro-German -- go back and try again!!!
Ah, sleaze rears it's hydra like head once again. Should those who approach ASL as primarily a game be shunned by those who consider it an historical re-creation simply because they take advantage of what the rules allow?

Being a gamer who is interested in WWII more than a WWII enthusiast who is a gamer I tend to go with what the rules allow. Note this is NOT the same as what the rules don't prohibit. Fish settled that discussion quite admirably and succinctly.
 

Craig Benn

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In Valor of the Guards CG, if an AFV is knocked out and not a burnt out wreck you can usually repair it and use it again a few CG days later. The repaired AFV gets a free crew. It seems to me having to pay purchase points for new crews would encourage people to take care of their bail outs. You would have to distinguish between vehicle 1-2-7s and MG platoon 1-2-7s though.
 
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Mister T

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For example: in the recent Action pack scenario "Red Horse Recon", the common SSR about not being able to voluntarily abandon AFVs was NOT included for exactly that reason.
While it was almost desperate I won it exactly for that reason :p
 

Old Noob

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If you're blinded by the light, stop heading towards it!
 

Paul M. Weir

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Hold on folks! We're arguing about the swapability of 127 and 228 crews on realism arguments. What about the 228 that came with your 3.7cm PaK 35/36 that represents 5 (later 3) gunners/loaders. They have the ability to replace the 10 or so crew of a 8.8cm FlaK 18/36/37 AA gun and conduct heavy AA fire without further training and yet suffer no ASL penalty. Ditto the 2 man T-40 crew can fully man an abandoned T-35 (10 man crew).

We have to accept that ASL is quite crude in representing specialities and limit the division to those who can drive and fight an AFV and those can man a gun even if exposed to rain and bullets.
 

Paul S NJ

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DC delivery is a little less dangerous use of them as they still must pay the unqualified use penalty as they are not "Elite" personnel (even if they recently U.A.ed an AFV and/or were considered SS).
I usually use non-elite troops to deliver DC's. If they're killed it's not as great a loss, and the extra +2 to malfunction tends not to mean much since if the target is in decent TEM a 10 or more won't have much effect anyway.
 
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