VASL6.6.2-beta3 released

Honosbinda

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no, I didn't pull any counters. It was an initial setup to roll for side, so I was just setting up for the log file without pulling counters.

The only thing you may not have added was that information table....I did add that. Then attempted to save. So, I never tried to start a log file, it was only an initial setup file.

One thing, when saving my finger kinda slipped a bit off the shift key when typing the file name, and I may have simultaneously hit the CTRL key, the Caps lock key and/or (very unlikely) the windows key. Not sure why any of those mistakes would have caused the VASL window to vanish, but thought I'd mention that in case it helps.
 

DougRim

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I have passed this thread on to Neal Ulen about a possible issue with the VASL Information Template.
 

DougRim

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Not a feature I use very much (at all), but tested it: 'Enter File Comments' feature when saving a game.

Text says: 'Enter comments describing this save or log file. They will appear when the file is loaded...etc.'

Result: no such text is displayed when the saved file is loaded (that I can see). I'm using RB map V3.
It should appear in the chat window. This is what I see when I saved a game, closed it and then reopened it.

The comments are the text inside the <b></b>. Not sure why the html stuff is shown but anyway. . . .

BTW, this is VASSAL functionality.

Let me know if you are not seeing the same kind of thing.

17424
 

Honosbinda

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I was trying to duplicate the chat window 'comments' error to demonstrate I didn't see anything in the chat window.

But now I'm getting a different problem. After launching VASSAL 3.5.4, I get an internal error every time I try to launch VASL 6.6.2-beta. I can't get it to open, even after robooting the system.

I'll try purging and reinstalling both programs and see if I can eliminate what may be a file corruption error.

[edit -- that seemed to work. this could be due to me trying to run both 3.2.17 and 3.5.4. these VASSAL modules don't like to share the same space and if clicking on a vsav file, sometimes it picks the wrong vassal module to launch, then all kinds of error messages come up. It's kinda annoying that vsav files don't know which version of vasl they are associated with, btw]
 
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JAGgamer

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Well, thank you, and the various Elves, for working so hard to keep The Game going!
 

Honosbinda

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It should appear in the chat window. This is what I see when I saved a game, closed it and then reopened it.

The comments are the text inside the <b></b>. Not sure why the html stuff is shown but anyway. . . .

BTW, this is VASSAL functionality.

Let me know if you are not seeing the same kind of thing.

View attachment 17424
As you can see, I am not seeing the usual dialog about which file is loaded at all, not to mention the save file comments. I checked preferences but didn't see any switch for this:

1743217433
 

uckelman

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[edit -- that seemed to work. this could be due to me trying to run both 3.2.17 and 3.5.4. these VASSAL modules don't like to share the same space and if clicking on a vsav file, sometimes it picks the wrong vassal module to launch, then all kinds of error messages come up. It's kinda annoying that vsav files don't know which version of vasl they are associated with, btw]
Saved games know what version of VASSAL they were saved with. What does not is the Windows file association. You can't associate a file type with more than one program, so whichever version of VASSAL was installed most recently will own the file association.
 

Honosbinda

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Saved games know what version of VASSAL they were saved with. What does not is the Windows file association. You can't associate a file type with more than one program, so whichever version of VASSAL was installed most recently will own the file association.
okay, thanks. It seems unlikely, but Is it possible to change the file association, for example, for all 3.2.17 games to be saved as .vsav2? If it works to do that manually, can this be automated? It would only make a difference if I could click on the file, otherwise, I have to open the version of VASL first anyway for 3.2.17 games.

Sounds like a stretch, though.
 

uckelman

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okay, thanks. It seems unlikely, but Is it possible to change the file association, for example, for all 3.2.17 games to be saved as .vsav2?
No, because the file association doesn't determine the extension of the file that VASSAL writes.
 

DougRim

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In my experience, it is a REALLY BAD idea to open .vsav files by double-clicking on them, especially with multiple VASSAL versions installed.

It worked fine when we 3.2.17 was the only version known in recorded history but since the advent of VASSAL3.3.X+, I would strongly discourage this method. Open VASSAL, open VASL and then select a saved game. Slower but no tears.
 

Neal

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I did some testing with the VASL Information Table Generator here: https://asl-players.net/vasl-tables/

I wasn't able to recreate the problem mentioned earlier (his scenario had html embedded in it).
  • I created a new setup with 6.6.2, embedded an html table. Saved it. Reloaded it okay.
  • I reloaded a previous fully setup, in progress scenario (using a TPP map, Biazza Ridge) from 6.6.1 into 6.6.2 with an existing html table embedded. Saved to the 6.6.2 VASL file format. Reloaded okay with 6.6.2.
Note that I did this running only one extension (VASL overlays). It might be helpful to list extensions that were active when trying to save the file.
 

Honosbinda

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In my experience, it is a REALLY BAD idea to open .vsav files by double-clicking on them, especially with multiple VASSAL versions installed.

It worked fine when we 3.2.17 was the only version known in recorded history but since the advent of VASSAL3.3.X+, I would strongly discourage this method. Open VASSAL, open VASL and then select a saved game. Slower but no tears.
Sure! Obviously, hindsite is 20/20 over here too, experience-wise and it was easy enough to figure out the solution on my own, what else could be done?

I wouldn't exaggerate how really bad the problem is, though, since it's a relatively minor problem in the big scheme of things. It's not unusual for people to use short cuts they expect to work, especially if their life is not in danger, after all:) What's the worse case, a reboot of the system? Re-installation of some files?

Doug, it's tedious to open and close VASSAL modules all the time, as I go back and forth between them a lot on a daily basis, now that I've agreed to test this new beta for problems. There are a lot of modules that can't use VASSAL 3.5.4. Most of them, I imagine. I only need it to test this beta at the moment.

My suggestion is to fix this double-click issue rather than advise tedious work-arounds. Get VASSAL ready for the 21st Century --maybe this is difficult, I don't know, but I know it's possible. There are plenty of applications where this isn't a problem. That's one reason WHY there is a file association, so one can click on the file to open the relevant application without the rigmarole! Surely people aren't going to tell me they don't ever click on .XLSX OR .DOCX files for a quick look, but instead go through the tedium of opening the application each time.

wrt the VASL Information Table Generator, I don't think it's the cause of what I saw. cheers Marc
 

uckelman

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My suggestion is to fix this double-click issue rather than advise tedious work-arounds.
You already have a fix: Have only one version of VASSAL installed.

This isn't peculiar to VASSAL. This would happen with any program having file associations for which you have multiple versions installed.
Surely people aren't going to tell me they don't ever click on .XLSX OR .DOCX files for a quick look, but instead go through the tedium of opening the application each time.
They're not, because they don't have two versions of Office installed.
 

Honosbinda

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You already have a fix: Have only one version of VASSAL installed.

This isn't peculiar to VASSAL. This would happen with any program having file associations for which you have multiple versions installed.

They're not, because they don't have two versions of Office installed.
Alright, but not the fix I was looking for. Perhaps I should have been more clear about my fuzzy ideas :) Maybe it's time to create a new file association for versions of VASSAL e.g .vsavx.

I don't get the impression this is going to be done, though.

These new versions beyond 3.3, 3.4 and 3.5 can't run ANY modules created with 3.2 -- if I understand correctly. I suppose I could partition the memory and create a virtual machine if i want to go that far. I don't want to dedicate a computer to testing VASL 3.5.4. with the 6.2.2 VASL beta, nor do I want to give up playing other modules with 3.2.17.

(Edit -- I wonder how difficult would it be to rig just the beta module to accept a different type of file extension save than .vasv or .vlog?]
 
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uckelman

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Alright, but not the fix I was looking for. Perhaps I should have been more clear about my fuzzy ideas :) Maybe it's time to create a new file association for versions of VASSAL e.g .vsavx.

I don't get the impression this is going to be done, though.
No, it's not. That's because it wouldn't solve the problem you're having. If you had an extension for files written by VASSAL 3.2, then later versions should also be able to read those files, and ought to also take over the file association for them.

These new versions beyond 3.3, 3.4 and 3.5 can't run ANY modules created with 3.2 -- if I understand correctly.
That's not correct at all. The vast majority of modules written by 3.2 are usable in 3.3 and later.
 

Honosbinda

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No, it's not. That's because it wouldn't solve the problem you're having. If you had an extension for files written by VASSAL 3.2, then later versions should also be able to read those files, and ought to also take over the file association for them.


That's not correct at all. The vast majority of modules written by 3.2 are usable in 3.3 and later.
Okay I'll give them a try. thanks. But the later versions aren't working for VASL [saves for 3.2.17], which is the immediate issue. cheers
 

Honosbinda

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The vast majority of modules written by 3.2 are usable in 3.3 and later.
I checked all my modules of games played over the years. Many do work, as you said.

However, two recent modules I play more than most (other than VASL) are Command and Colors Napoleonics v3.42 and Space Empires 4x c3.07. Neither of these modules are playable with 3.5.4.

It's known to the respective developers that these are issues related to the module and in both cases new modules are being developed to work with VASSAL 3.4 and higher.
But to play these games I have to run them on 3.2.17.

Hence, my conclusion that many other modules might have the same problem is based on the fact that 90% of my game time is played on modules requiring the old version of VASSAL. Based on that experience, I assumed that when using the other 10% of the module, it would be safer to stick with 3.2.17.
 

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I do not see myself monkeying around with file associations for VASL. As I think is clear, this is driven by VASSAL and I am not inclined to move away from a consistent approach to VASSAL.

We have not yet isolated the cause of your recent crash. I hate to ask but if you could redo what you did and see if it crashes again, that might be helpful. From what you have told us we have tried to replicate the problem but so far have not been able to do so.

Thanks for your help in test driving 6.6.2-beta3. It is appreciated.
 

Honosbinda

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I do not see myself monkeying around with file associations for VASL. As I think is clear, this is driven by VASSAL and I am not inclined to move away from a consistent approach to VASSAL.
Sure, understood.
We have not yet isolated the cause of your recent crash. I hate to ask but if you could redo what you did and see if it crashes again, that might be helpful.
I can try to duplicate it but I think that will be very difficult due to the combination of events.

I think it was due to prior double clicking on a saved file for an OLD game that tried to access VASSAL 3.5.4 when it had been saved in VASSAL 3.2.17. That caused some major errors and subsequently corruption somewhere in VASSAL.exe (3.5.4) when I tried to save a file for NEW game I intended for testing. On top of that, there may have been an odd keystroke combo error as mentioned which triggered the crash of the save.

In fact, in those error messages from VASSAL, there was some notice that corruption was possible and that the VASSAL file might need to be recompiled. You should be able to duplicate that sequence of messages by saving a file in 3.2.17 then double-clicking on the file without using the open application to load it. If you have 3.5.4 installed also, then as I understand it (per Uckelman and yourself), the file will try to use 3.5.4 as the most recently installed version of VASSAL. You will see (and are already aware this will happen, I think) a messy cascade of error messages indicating a variety of failures -- sorry I don't have screen shots of that right now. One of the errors is persistent and cannot be shut down easily -- as per your warning of not double-clicking on files to open applications.

My assessment (involving the least amount of assumptions) is that what I reported as a crash was a subsequent error due to the prior double-click on the OLD save file (corrupting 3.5.4).

I say this because since then, I've reinstalled Vassal 3.5.4 and reconstituted the save file a second time (including Neal's table), which works fine now. Additionally, I've sent this save file to my computer-savvy opponent, who is also using VASSAL 3.5.4 and the 6.2.2-beta and he has had no problems with the file, either. However, we have yet to work with the file back and forth as we won't commence our game until next weekend.

Based on this experience, I think it may be problematic to test new versions of Vassal on a machine that has the old versions of Vassal, but I don't have a spare computer that is running windows 10; 99% of the use of Vassal is on this desktop, so it makes sense to use it.

[Edit -- as mentioned earlier, I could create a virtual machine with a memory partition of some kind, I have a vague idea of how to do it, but haven't tried it before and I might need some special software. Then I could use the virtual CPU structure to test the new Vassal module in isolation. Is this what you do?]
 

DougRim

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Based on this experience, I think it may be problematic to test new versions of Vassal on a machine that has the old versions of Vassal, but I don't have a spare computer that is running windows 10; 99% of the use of Vassal is on this desktop, so it makes sense to use it.

[Edit -- as mentioned earlier, I could create a virtual machine with a memory partition of some kind, I have a vague idea of how to do it, but haven't tried it before and I might need some special software. Then I could use the virtual CPU structure to test the new Vassal module in isolation. Is this what you do?]
I am much less ambitious. I simply use one version of VASSAL for one thing and another for another. Currently, I have a regular game with two opponents, a long-running CG in 6.5.1/3.2.17. We started it using that and finish it that way.

I have another regular opponent who is currently on 3.4.11 (unless he has changed without telling me!) and so I use 6.6.1/3.4.11 with him.

When doing development work on VASL, I tend to use the latest VASSAL version. So, 6.6.2 has been developed in 3.4.5. I see 3.5.5 is out today and I will move to whatever the latest version of VASSAL is when I put out the official release.

I have not had any major conflict issues but then I always start VASSAL, start VASL, etc, etc. Now that VASSAL shows the VASSAL version in the top of the VASSAL window, I find it easier to ensure I am using the correct VASL/VASSAL combo.
 
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