ASL Journals in PDF Format

FMFCB

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My point was everything could be put out there to be printed in order to bring older HASLs back in the world
I agree with your point and by talking about them I hope MMP understands there is interest in them.
 

Scott_Blanton

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Many of the older HASLs are not in current electronic formats and would require significant work update/convert the files into a format that can be used to create the PDFs.
 

Gordon

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Many of the older HASLs are not in current electronic formats and would require significant work update/convert the files into a format that can be used to create the PDFs.
I'd bet that if you put out a call for volunteers to work on those you would get plenty.
 

Larry

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Many of the older HASLs are not in current electronic formats and would require significant work update/convert the files into a format that can be used to create the PDFs.
Some could consider that a quiet enlistment of volunteers.
 

21Z5M

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No one said it was easy but you just need motivated people
 

Pacman Ghost

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I'd bet that if you put out a call for volunteers to work on those you would get plenty.
This is not really the way to do it. There's a big discussion going on now in the open-source (*) community about how big companies are making massive profits off the back of work done by volunteers, and while this is a bit smaller-scale :), the idea is the same. Give the older HASL's to the community, and then invite people to work on them. Keeping them proprietary, getting people to work on them for free, then making money off that work is not cool.

Years ago, there was a computer game called Falcon 4.0 that had its program code leaked, and programmers grabbed it and started fixing bugs, improving the graphics and game play, to the point where it's now significantly better than the original :) They did it for free, because they liked the game and they wanted to make it better. If MMP feel that it's not financially viable to resurrect these older HASL's, as they did the old Journals and Annuals, it might worth considering giving what they have to the community, and see what happens. AIUI, MMP doesn't own this stuff, Hasbro does, so ultimately, it's not their call, but if MMP think that it's not worth doing themselves, they could maybe go back to the mothership and make a suggestion...?

(*) This is where people write software and then make it available for free e.g. VASSAL, VASL.
 
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21Z5M

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I’m sure the margin on producing and publishing theses games are very small
 

Pacman Ghost

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I’m sure the margin on producing and publishing theses games are very small
Yes, that was kinda my point :) If it doesn't make financial sense to resurrect these things, then they will just languish at the bottom of someone's drawer, never to see the light of day of again. Opening them up creates the possibility that they could come back to life again. But persuading a big company to give up the rights to a product that they own and sell is a big ask...
 

boylermaker

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This is not really the way to do it. There's a big discussion going on now in the open-source (*) community about how big companies are making massive profits off the back of work done by volunteers, and while this is a bit smaller-scale :), the idea is the same.
Except that work that would be asked for is already done. There are scads of people who have made personal scans of their whole collections (wasn't that the starting point for the Journals that are on WGV now?). Pick a nice one and sell it. I get a HASL I could never afford for cheap, MMP gets some moola, somebody who provided a scan they had already done anyway gets $50 from MMP or whatever, everybody wins. I don't really see the value in beancounting whether MMP is winning "too much" in this scenario.
 

Pacman Ghost

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Except that work that would be asked for is already done. There are scads of people who have made personal scans of their whole collections (wasn't that the starting point for the Journals that are on WGV now?).
If it's just a question of selling a scanned version, then yes, it's a non-issue. MMP could do that themselves, with minimal effort. But if you look at what they've done for the rulebook, and the old magazines they've resurrected, it's an enormous amount of work. Just creating all the links in the RB would've been a massive undertaking, but they've also incorporated all the errata, tidied up the layout, updated the scenarios, etc. etc. It provides a huge amount of value, and it's greatly appreciated, but you have to wonder how cost-effective it was i.e. how many dollars will they get back for the number of hours spent working on it? And for the more obscure HASL's, what are the chances such a project would get green-lit, based on projected ROI? But this is exactly the kind of thing hobbyists would do, just for the love of it.
 
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Ric of The LBC

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If it's just a question of selling a scanned version, then yes, it's a non-issue. MMP could do that themselves, with minimal effort. But if you look at what they've done for the rulebook, and the old magazines they've resurrected, it's an enormous amount of work. Just creating all the links in the RB would've been a massive undertaking, but they've also incorporated all the errata, tidied up the layout, updated the scenarios, etc. etc. It provides a huge amount of value, and it's greatly appreciated, but you have to wonder how cost-effective it was i.e. how many dollars will they get back for the number of hours spent working on it? And for the more obscure HASL's, what are the chances such a project would get green-lit, based on projected ROI? But this is exactly the kind of thing hobbyists would do, just for the love of it.
My understanding is the proofreaders for the eASLRB did it all for free, not even a free copy.
 

21Z5M

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So is it possible in the future? My maps are getting old
 

Rison.Az

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Ill chime in really quick: would love to have the HASL rules available, and would be willing to pay for them on a per HASL basis (ie. have the rules for BRT as its own thing).

BRT is on my bucket list. But at $300 for the module I havnt pulled the trigger on it for years. If the rules were available in PDF format, I would just use VASL to play it as I still have kids and pets in my house (and love it!) so having a map like that setup just isnt possible at this point. And I dont want to take a scan from someone else, as if I am getting it digitially I want it to be on the up and up and for MMP to get their deserved kickback from it.

So my cents: make the HASL rule sections available in PDF format for those of us who are willing to play over VASL with the maps that are already available.

Thanks for all these additions to out of print items - really the greatest, and long with the eASLRB, the future of ASL is looking great!

Chad
 

von Marwitz

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BRT is on my bucket list. But at $300 for the module I havnt pulled the trigger on it for years. If the rules were available in PDF format, I would just use VASL to play it as I still have kids and pets in my house (and love it!) so having a map like that setup just isnt possible at this point. And I dont want to take a scan from someone else, as if I am getting it digitially I want it to be on the up and up and for MMP to get their deserved kickback from it.
Well, you can find an opponent who owns the necessary rules for BRT and play it on VASL with him.

It is not improper to do so. MMP (nor any other gaming company for that matter) cannot expect both players to buy a product when the two of them come together to play it. You can only play on one map after all and can only use one set of counters at a time. Expecting anything beyond that would be quite absurd.

Just imagine: Five people coming together to play a game of Monopoly. One doesn't own the game. "Well, that's too sad. Not owning the game you may not play with us..."

von Marwitz
 

jyoung

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So my cents: make the HASL rule sections available in PDF format for those of us who are willing to play over VASL with the maps that are already available.
There seemed to be an indication that these would be included in the eASLRB at some point in the future, which would be great.
 

Actionjick

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Well, you can find an opponent who owns the necessary rules for BRT and play it on VASL with him.

It is not improper to do so. MMP (nor any other gaming company for that matter) cannot expect both players to buy a product when the two of them come together to play it. You can only play on one map after all and can only use one set of counters at a time. Expecting anything beyond that would be quite absurd.

Just imagine: Five people coming together to play a game of Monopoly. One doesn't own the game. "Well, that's too sad. Not owning the game you may not play with us..."

von Marwitz
Very thoughtful reasoning.
 

Rison.Az

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Well, you can find an opponent who owns the necessary rules for BRT and play it on VASL with him.

It is not improper to do so. MMP (nor any other gaming company for that matter) cannot expect both players to buy a product when the two of them come together to play it. You can only play on one map after all and can only use one set of counters at a time. Expecting anything beyond that would be quite absurd.

Just imagine: Five people coming together to play a game of Monopoly. One doesn't own the game. "Well, that's too sad. Not owning the game you may not play with us..."

von Marwitz
No disagreement at all. If I was going to someones house and they had a scenario, I wouldnt feel like I had to own it, I would be more than happy to play that scenario - whether stand alone or HASL.

But . . .

HASL's, especially BRT, have a LOT of rules. Rules that need to be read and re-read numerous times. I like to have a copy for myself so I can thoroughly go over the rules before I start playing.

And ASL is all about collecting right? Its nice to continue what I started as a teenager in the 80's'/90's. Its nice to 'have' the various elements of ASL on hand for your use.

And finally, I only have a few hobbies (ASL, CM, GOSS) and I want to see them succeed as a company as they are small companies - so any chance I have to support them financially through their products I take it to help keep their revenue stream alive. As a business owner I unfortunately understand staying alive all too well :)

Couldnt be happier to see ASL not only surviving, but thriving apparently.

Thanks

Chad
 
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