VASL LOS with Elevation?

76mm

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The VASL LOS tool is incredibly helpful, but for me the most useful thing of all would be if it would help determine LOS when different elevations are involved...is there some way to do this that I'm missing?
 

A_T_Great

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The VASL LOS tool is incredibly helpful, but for me the most useful thing of all would be if it would help determine LOS when different elevations are involved...is there some way to do this that I'm missing?
Yes you can. Ctrl arrow up and ctrl arrow down, while you are drawing the LOS thread.
 

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That is awesome, thanks alot!
 

boylermaker

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And just "arrow-up" and "arrow-down" change what level the other end of the thread is at.
 

fzmann

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Note that if there are any overlays, the LOS tool seems to not work properly. At least that’s my experience. YMMV
 

DougRim

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Note that if there are any overlays, the LOS tool seems to not work properly. At least that’s my experience. YMMV
Not sure what you mean by "not work properly". Since the LOS check functionality does not work with overlays at all, what should happen is that whenever a LOS is drawn over an overlay (or more specifically over the rectangle that encloses the overlay), a red box should appear around the overlay with a message saying that LOS cannot be determined due to the overlay or something like that. Are you getting some kind of other behaviour?
 

fzmann

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Not sure what you mean by "not work properly". Since the LOS check functionality does not work with overlays at all, what should happen is that whenever a LOS is drawn over an overlay (or more specifically over the rectangle that encloses the overlay), a red box should appear around the overlay with a message saying that LOS cannot be determined due to the overlay or something like that. Are you getting some kind of other behaviour?
I chose to express the idea of the LOS tool not working with overlays the way I did because I don’t recall *exactlywhat happens.
In addition, LOS checks can still be made, because the LOS tool serves as the “thread” with the players making the determination of LOS existing or not.
Thus my hesitancy at saying the tool doesn’t work at all with overlays.
But when the LOS tool works, it really works.
 

DougRim

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I chose to express the idea of the LOS tool not working with overlays the way I did because I don’t recall *exactlywhat happens.
In addition, LOS checks can still be made, because the LOS tool serves as the “thread” with the players making the determination of LOS existing or not.
Thus my hesitancy at saying the tool doesn’t work at all with overlays.
But when the LOS tool works, it really works.
Thanks. Sometimes we do get bugs in the system so I wanted to be sure as to what was happening at your end. Doesn't seem like a bug. Overlays do complicate the LOS tool. Previously, if a board had an overlay, the LOS tool would just kick out and not work at all for any los on the board. All you would get is the VASSAL los string. Now, the tools works except when it actually hits an overlay and then it reports the fact to the user. So, progress but not perfect. Extending LOS to overlays would be such a huge piece of work that I don't see it happening.
 

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Well, the current LOS tool is pretty awesomely fantastic, so thanks to whoever worked on it!
 

76mm

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hmm, one more question: I see how to elevate one end of the LOS thread, but is it possible to elevate both ends? Can't see how to do that...
 

jrv

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hmm, one more question: I see how to elevate one end of the LOS thread, but is it possible to elevate both ends? Can't see how to do that...
up & down arrow at the second end, ctrl-up & ctrl down at the first.

JR
 

zgrose

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BTW, these keystrokes and extra information about the LOS tool can also be found in the VASL Help menu under LOS check. Some handy tidbits in there about what works when.
 

76mm

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BTW, these keystrokes and extra information about the LOS tool can also be found in the VASL Help menu under LOS check. Some handy tidbits in there about what works when.
Thanks, couldn't find a manual, guess I didn't think to look at the Help menu.
 

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Agree the LOS tool is pretty fantastic. Follow up question - is there a "best" way to make terrain changes to preserve LOS functionality as much as possible? I'm playing with the RB board, placing a rubble counter on a (e.g. 1 1/2 level) building hex seems to replace the 1 1/2 level obstacle with a 1/2 level obstacle that the LOS tool recognizes. But when putting a shellhole counter on a wooden rubble hex, the LOS tool still thinks there is a 1/2 level obstacle there. And as mentioned above, using overlays instead of counters doesn't work for LOS.
Is there a usual practice for this? It's just that once you've experienced the wonderful functionality and convenience of VASL it's hard to go back to using the good old Mk 1 Eyeball :)
 

DougRim

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Agree the LOS tool is pretty fantastic. Follow up question - is there a "best" way to make terrain changes to preserve LOS functionality as much as possible? I'm playing with the RB board, placing a rubble counter on a (e.g. 1 1/2 level) building hex seems to replace the 1 1/2 level obstacle with a 1/2 level obstacle that the LOS tool recognizes. But when putting a shellhole counter on a wooden rubble hex, the LOS tool still thinks there is a 1/2 level obstacle there. And as mentioned above, using overlays instead of counters doesn't work for LOS.
Is there a usual practice for this? It's just that once you've experienced the wonderful functionality and convenience of VASL it's hard to go back to using the good old Mk 1 Eyeball :)
In 6.5.0 I added new rubble counters that you can adjust the level on so that you can rubble upper level buildings and the los tool will still understand that there is a higher elevation/obstacle in the hex. On the toolbar, click the cellar counter and then select the funky looking half-brown, half-green wooden rubble counter. Drag it on the map and then right-click and from the menu select the proper type (wood/stone) and level. It worked in testing!

Remember that LOS only works on RBv2 not other versions of the RB board.
 

dlazov

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Note that I have reported this elsewhere but here it is again:


I have stated this before. The LOS tool is broken both on Windows and Mac. If you save a game and reopen it the LOS tool no longer works (reports blocked LOS or hindrances and range), likewise if you set/use the Terrain SSR for walls or hedges the LOS tool no longer works. The error reports that the LOS has been disabled in one of the Java classes.

I have reported this yo Zoultan on Discord and he sent my log and save files up.

The work around to get the LOS tool to work again is to pull new boards and don’t use the Terrain SSR feature and DO NOT save the game to prevent the code from disabling the LOS tool.

Hopefully this bug gets fixed.
 

Jazz

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The VASL LOS tool is incredibly helpful, but for me the most useful thing of all would be if it would help determine LOS when different elevations are involved...is there some way to do this that I'm missing?
I assume you are familiar with the LazyLOS tool? With something as funky and calculating blind hexes I like to have two forms of verification.
 
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