Goliath

[buser333]

I assume that Goliaths have start and stop MP like any other vehicle since the only exception listed in Chapter H is that they have no VCA changes? Though, if it does, I don't know why anybody would stop it.

Also, I assume that a limbered Goliath can be pushed per it's M# of 11, as it is not being "controlled" at that time?

And lastly, since it is treated as a SW, can two Goliaths be detonated in AFPh simultaneously by two units in the same hex (much like firegrouping SW at the same target hex)?

 

[Michael R]

No to the fire group, just like a DC cannot fire group.

 

[Robin Reeve]

And lastly, since it is treated as a SW, can two Goliaths be detonated in AFPh simultaneously by two units in the same hex (much like firegrouping SW at the same target hex)?

No firegroup.
However, detonating the first Goliath will most probably detonate the other one in its Location, thus generating a successive attack.

 

[Binchois]

The Goliath rules leave a lot of things unsaid (I just discovered this amusing thread, courtesy of JR's wit). I think Ger. Veh. Note 93 has been edited somewhat since that thread and for my thinking, most of this can be inferred:

1) As stated, you do not have to pay MPs for VCA changes, however, Start/Stop would be necessary (as the thing moves like an AFV). Experts would know if these things could travel in reverse, but knowing how remote controlled cars work, I'd say they would be severely limited on a battlefield if they couldn't! Wikipedia tells me that Goliaths sometimes had a joystick control box, so until the RB says otherwise, I would also allow reverse motion...

2) The internet also tells me that these things were small, but very heavy! However, an M# implies pushing is allowed along with towing - though naturally in its limbered state only.

3) As per Michael R, no you can't FG Goliaths (A23.1 "A DC attack may not combine FP with any other unit."). I have never tried to place two DC on the same target, but I suppose whichever one goes off first, there is a chance that a KIA will destroy the second one (Random SW Destruction) without it getting to explode also. In the case of a Goliath, the weapon is attacked as an unarmored target, with instructions on how it too could go off (a KIA which would create a burning wreck results in an explosion). So if you have two Goliaths, perhaps you could attempt this kind of chain reaction!

 

[SFiedler]

I have never tried to place two DC on the same target, but I suppose whichever one goes off first, there is a chance that a KIA will destroy the second one (Random SW Destruction) without it getting to explode also. In the case of a Goliath, the weapon is attacked as an unarmored target, with instructions on how it too could go off (a KIA which would create a burning wreck results in an explosion). So if you have two Goliaths, perhaps you could attempt this kind of chain reaction!

Aha! NOw my warped brain is thinking about multiple numbers of Goliaths stacked in same locations (Preferably HIP) to create a massive, chained overkill sequence. BTW Can Goliaths be HIP?

 

[buser333]

Aha! NOw my warped brain is thinking about multiple numbers of Goliaths stacked in same locations (Preferably HIP) to create a massive, chained overkill sequence. BTW Can Goliaths be HIP?

Being SWs I don't see how they could be unless possessed by a hidden unit or allowed by SSR.

 

[SFiedler]

Being SWs I don't see how they could be unless possessed by a hidden unit or allowed by SSR.

If they move and stop like a vehicle what about a massive wave of platoon moving Goliaths :clap:

 

[Binchois]

Aha! NOw my warped brain is thinking about multiple numbers of Goliaths stacked in same locations (Preferably HIP) to create a massive, chained overkill sequence. BTW Can Goliaths be HIP?

Being SWs I don't see how they could be unless possessed by a hidden unit or allowed by SSR.

Just to throw another monkey in the wrench:

Unit: Any game piece or Counter with its own MF/MP allotment and normally capable of movement without being portaged, pushed, or towed.​

And

A7.35 SW USAGE: All weapons on 1/2" counters are SW [EXC: Goliath]​

Curiously, this last exception is not in the index definition. Ger. Veh. Note 93 says that Goliaths are counted as a SW for stacking purposes and as SW usage for the operating HS. It does not say that they ARE SWs.

I would guess that HIP is a possibility...but who knows what was intended (or what Perry would say)?

 

[Brian W]

Being SWs I don't see how they could be unless possessed by a hidden unit or allowed by SSR.

Is it a hole in the rules that only Guns can be pushed by a GO crew/towed by a vehicle, or is there something in the vehicle note that I missed?

 

[buser333]

Is it a hole in the rules that only Guns can be pushed by a GO crew/towed by a vehicle, or is there something in the vehicle note that I missed?

The pushing rules do specifically mention Guns don't they? Me seems there is a hole in the rules, or Goliaths were not meant to be pushed as I don't believe there is anything in their vehicle notes covering this one way or the other.

 

[Michael R]

Is it a hole in the rules that only Guns can be pushed by a GO crew/towed by a vehicle, or is there something in the vehicle note that I missed?

Motorcycles and jeeps can also be pushed, sort of.

 

[Elfego Baca]

Late to the party, and about to play ASL135/A68 Acts of Defiance ....

Is there a DRM for igniting a Goliath while its in Motion?

 

[jrv]

Is there a DRM for igniting a Goliath while its in Motion?

It's hard to tell whether by "igniting" it you mean causing an enemy one to blow up by becoming a burning wreck or whether you mean as a DRM to the effects DR of a friendly one when detonated by its controller. If fired on by ordnance the TH DR would be affected by case J, which would decrease the chances of making it a burning wreck, i.e. "igniting" it. Its Motion status would have no effect on the Effects DR if a hit is achieved. Other than this "indirect" effect the Motion status of the goliath should have no effect on either fire against it or attacks by it.

JR

 

[Elfego Baca]

JRV:

Sorry for using the wrong term.

I'll rephrase ..... Is a drm applied when attempting to detonate a Goliath in Motion?

 

[jrv]

JRV:

Sorry for using the wrong term.

I'll rephrase ..... Is a drm applied when attempting to detonate a Goliath in Motion?

I don't believe there is.

JR

 

[Elfego Baca]

This thread won't die.

Am I correct that a Goliath qualifies for road movement cost (1/2 MP per road hex.) .... It can't BU.

 

[jrv]

Am I correct that a Goliath qualifies for road movement cost (1/2 MP per road hex.) .... It can't BU.

Vehicle Note 93: "...is treated as a fully-tracked BU AFV for movement purposes." This line is sticky errata, but I don't know from what set. It would have to be earlier if I don't have the source marked.

JR

 

[jrv]

Found it: it's from J7 errata.

JR

 

[Elfego Baca]

TY JRV.

Jeff B (the OP of this thread) & I are about to play Acts of Defiance, and I'm trying to come up to speed with usage of the Goliaths.

 

[bendizoid]

You need a five to blow a bridge.