Mandatory FG 7.55

[SSlunt]

Is the following within the rules
Firstly
Assume 2 Russian 4-4-7 squad in the same hex
The Germans assault moves a 4-6-7 adjacent
The Russian fires a single squad marking it with a First Fire
The Germans finish the movement phase
During the Defensive fire phase the Russian Fire the squad that has First fired and the squad that has not yet fired together in a single fire group marking the Russian squads with a Final Fire counter?

Second
Assume two Russian squad one with a LMG adjacent to each other
The Germans assault moves a 4-6-7 adjacent
The Russian fires a single squad marking it with a First Fire
The Germans finish the movement phase
During the Defensive fire phase the Russian Fire the squad that has First fired the LMG and the squad that has not yet fired together in a single fire group marking both Russian stacks with a Final Fire counter?

I am pretty sure that it falls within 7.55 but would like some feed back.

 

[Brian W]

Yes, both fire groups are permissible or required depending on how you would want to try to break into two or more attacks.

 

[GeorgeBates]

Why is this in the "Perry sez" folder?

 

[Jazz]

Yes why is this in the PerrySez folder? I do not see a PerrySez anywhere

 

[SSlunt]

Because I made a mistake. Please move

 

[Brian W]

I reported your post to be moved last night when I replied. It will be moved eventually.

 

[Aavar]

1st case - yes - Mandatory FG rule applies - as both squads are in the same location
2nd case - No - Mandatory FG rule does not apply, as both squads are in different locations. but as Brian says can form a Voluntary multi-location FG

 

[Binchois]

1st case - yes - Mandatory FG rule applies - as both squads are in the same location
2nd case - No - Mandatory FG rule does not apply, as both squads are in different locations. but as Brian says can form a Voluntary multi-location FG

Not exactly sure I understand you, but to be clear, neither case is restricted by A7.55.

A7.55 restricts the two squads in one location (or one squad and its LMG) from splitting its attack versus one target during the same phase or the same MF/MP expenditure within the MPh. It has no bearing on how units in separate locations fire (I think this is what you were saying).

Even during the MPh, however, some flexibility is allowed. For example, take the two Russian squads in one location. If the German makes seperate MF expenditures, either Russian (or both) must fire if they were to fire during the 1st expenditure. However, if only one Russian fires, they could later combine to fire during the 2nd MF expenditure or at a different target (the first squad using SFF, the other using First Fire).

The same would be true with the Russian squad and its LMG. You could fire first just the LMG, and if necessary fire both the squad and LMG (using ROF or sustained fire) on any subsequent MFs spent by the Germans.

And to return to the OP (second case): if the Germans ended the MPh adjacent to the Russians, they could then be recombined in any way desired to make their Final Fire attempts (possibly restricted as per their previous use...1/2 firepower, sustained fire, as needed...)

Post edited to correct certain details!

 

[klasmalmstrom]

...For example, take the two Russian squads in one location. If the German expends 2MF to enter a location, either Russian (or both) must fire if they were to fire during the 1st MF. However, if only one Russian fires, they could later combine to fire during the 2nd MF or at a different target (the first squad using SFF, the other using First Fire).

I am not sure they can, as Mandatory FG applies vs the same MF expenditure.

A7.55 MANDATORY FG: If Good Order units/weapons in the same Location are going to fire at the same target (i.e., at both the same Location and the same unit and the same “simultaneous” [8.1] MF/MP expenditure; see D3.5) during the same phase they must form a FG [EXC: Fire Lane; 9.22]; they may not attack separately except with ordnance/FT/DC or the subsequent shots of multiple ROF weapons (9.2).

 

[Binchois]

I am not sure they can, as Mandatory FG applies vs the same MF expenditure.

A7.55 MANDATORY FG: If Good Order units/weapons in the same Location are going to fire at the same target (i.e., at both the same Location and the same unit and the same “simultaneous” [8.1] MF/MP expenditure; see D3.5) during the same phase they must form a FG [EXC: Fire Lane; 9.22]; they may not attack separately except with ordnance/FT/DC or the subsequent shots of multiple ROF weapons (9.2).

You are right! Sorry I was hasty and for that reason wrong! It is true that if infantry moves into woods, that's two, simultaneous, MFs as per the rule cited. What I should have said is that subsequent expenditures would allow the Russians other options.

...I will edit my last post to reflect your correction and to keep others from being confused (except those who know to routinely ignore my posts!)