@ Bullethead: Jutland campaign suggestions/wishes

[TBR]

Now that L'empereur has told us who we have to "shoot" our Jutland campaign-related ideas at, lets fire away!

The most likely scenario is to update the campaign(s) after release to allow for more and more "enduser" interaction.

One of the first and most basic ideas is to provide hooks for the enduser to expand/add to news events.

Variablitiy might be added in a simliar way over time or included upon release by having alternative campaigns available.

Bullethead is the one to shoot ideas at here for those types of ideas.

He

[TBR]

My suggestions:

Presupposing a campaign map limited to the North sea and its immediate environs:
- optional campaign spanning the total length of the war (might need some ships added (SMS Blücher etc))
- optional alt-history "last-hurra" 1918-1920 campaign, including some more "Bayerns" and "Mackensens" etc. that originally never were completed, if they can be reasonably be expected to have been commisioned in the new timeline.
- a toggle allowing ahistorical reinforcement to the Homefleet by not originally included RN ships, perhaps dependent on campaign losses when the Admiralty gradually reduces worldwide commitment in reaction to German successes (which will give us, as a German player, the opportunity to sink the whole RN :D and consequently ensure that tremendously successfull campaigns will remain playable longer)
- a toggle allowing ahistorical reinforcement to the Homefleet by USN and French forces (will need some ships added)

If I drop the premise above I requote parts of my earlier wishlist:

1) campaign spanning the total length of the war with "European waters" map, Baltic, North Sea, Western Atlantic, Mediterranean, including French, Italian, Austrian and Ottoman navies
2) as above with "alt history ending", letting ships like the later Bayerns, the Mackensens et al appear, including appearance of the USN, IJN duration ca. until 1920

[vertical]

Me thinks they are a little late in development to add suggestions. I may be wrong though...

vertical

[bill44]

The ability to bombard the coastal towns.

[Batou]

Jutland Campaign Suggestions

Beyond the historic campaign I would like to see some player options that could be set to add some variation to the campaign.

1. Ship Delay Option (small/medium/large) that would vary the delay of new ships by 30/60/90 days for British, German or both.

2. Additional Ship Option (British/German) that would add ships that were sunk before 1916 or ships stationed elsewhere. Cloned or sister ships would be ideal for this, thus not requiring new or additional 3D models of course any new 3D models would be welcomed!

3. Variable Start up Option, where the location and arrival of ships would be different from the historical setup.

4. Weather (better/worse) Option, where you would get more or less bad weather during the campaign.

5. Sub Option, where subs would be more or less effective.

6. Mine Option, where mines would be more or less effective.

7. Gunnery Option, where the player could select British or German gunnery to be 1 or 2 percent more effective.


Thanks

[rgreat]

Seems like you want difficulty options and campaign editor. ;)

Well, i second that.

[Batou]

Seems like you want difficulty options and campaign editor. ;)

Well, i second that.

A campaign editor would be great but, that's not what I asking for, just some options to add some variety to the existing campaign. Turn all the options off and you got the historic campaign, turn some or all of them on and you got a different ball game. The campaign in RJW was a little to set in cement for my taste.

[PepsiCan]

My earlier suggestion of not just listing ships sunk, but also crew deads and wounded.

[rgreat]

My earlier suggestion of not just listing ships sunk, but also crew deads and wounded.
And more statistics on a number of rounds shoot, hits taken and hits placed after battle for each ship and each caliber of that ship.

[Damabiah]

Room 40 please

[anav]

I would like to see the ability of both sides to plan and conduct an entire operation in the North Sea or English channel, with enough intell for the other side to respond. By entire operation I mean a real mission, not just steam out and find the enemy. Victory then would be both tactical and strategic. Tactical going to the player who did the most damage, and strategic going to the player who accomplished the mission or prevented it.
It's been my experience that a scenario designed without a mission makes no sense in terms of what a real fleet and real commanders would do in battle. These battles in fact just turn into a sort of giant mill around the ocean affairs that are mostly unsatisfying to both sides no matter who "wins" them.
The operation can occur at any time during World War One with the OOB automatically selected by the date. They would be complete with submarine patrols on both sides, mine fields and swept channels, Zeppelins, troop convoys, fishing fleets, merchant traffic, coastal and zeppelin base bombardment options. The would start when one side gets underway. In short each op would be a mini campaign lasting the 2 or 3 days of the operation.
As an aside I'd like to see a real representation of the strengths and weaknesses of gunnery on both sides. The Germans could and did find the range quicker then the British. They had better optics and a better range finding system. So in fights with variable visibility (like Jutland) they appeared to shoot better then the British. On the other hand the British had a more modern fire control system with director fire. So unlike in German ships all British gun laying was done by the director. This meant that British salvos were grouped much tighter then German ones. The Germans themselves remarked on this many times at Jutland. It meant that once the range was found the British are likely to hit much harder then the German.

Regards ANav

[FastPhil]

One of the issues with having a Campaign for the whole war or a part greater than the period covered by Jutland, is that it would not just mean different OOBs in the traditional sense. I think you will find that the same ships would have to have more than 'ship' represented in the game. For example I believe the KM upgunned the secondary batteries of many capital ships after Jutland. Along with possible FC updates, armor etc. With SES's attention to detail, you would expect this but I am not sure if the game engine as it stands now has that ability. I guess it shouldn't be too hard but I'm not a programmer.

I agree with ANAV's ideas for the campaign and possibly mini-campaigns. We played the 1914 Campaign using modified GWAS rules to run the strategic/operational portion of it, and used HPS' Jutland for the tactical portion. The Umpire would create a tactical scenario based upon the campaign using the scenario editor in Jutland and we fought it out MP-I think we had 16 palyers in the last one.

[Firestorm]

Room 40 please

This is my question as well. Will the British get advanced intel as when the Germans set sail and what course? This would simulate Room 40 in my opinion.

[Bullethead]

I wish somebody would make this into a sticky, up there with the "Wish List" thread.

Sorry I'm not cleared to release much info on your questions right now. However, I'm reading this thread with great interest and making notes :).

I can say, however, that you're extremely unlikely to see a campaign covering the full war. It's hard enough making one for a year.

[anav]

A campaign covering the whole war, while it sounds wonderful, would probably take longer then all of us have to live. We'd have to pass our assignment down to our children. Besides naval campaigns are mostly hours and hours of endless steaming or sitting in port waiting for something to happen.
Far better in my view to turn an operation or mission into a short campaign, then perhaps have the ability to string them together by leaping over all the dull parts to the next mission. Let the game generate a new OOB by the historical availabilty of new construction, and transfers. Also however include the losses and damage from the last mission to avoid mass Destroyer or Torpedo Boat (no tomorrow) suicide in the final moments any given operation.
In this way if the KM suffered a lot of damage the next mission would not be for a long time. While if the RN suffered a great deal of damage and the KM did not, then it might embark on another mission very soon to take advantage of presumed RN weakness. Finally add a random for non combat related damage and needed refits to take some ships out of each fleet unexpectedly.
Room 40 could be simulated by simply informing the RN player of the underway time and course of the High Seas Fleet a random number of hours in advance. In this way the German side would never know when the RN is at sea, while the RN would never be sure exactly where the KM is going. If Histoical minefields/ingress and egress restrictions are applied to the HSF then the RN can guess a general direction of the enemy but would still have to cast the net wide to find them. Thus leaving open the prospect of a combined HSF falling on only a part of the Grand Fleet every time.

Regards ANav