Some questions...

[Conao]

Hello All,

I have just (finally) kiked-off turn two to Tiberius. It has been an overwhelming amount of new information and techniques for me in these last days. I've been trying to find enough time to read as much as I can from this forum, but I think that my wife's patience is on the edge already, so I'd rather get slow down...

These is my first PBEM game and so far I have learned more than in the last almost two years I've been playing COW against the PO! I managed to get 8 combat rounds in my first turn (turn 2, to be clear)! I not even knew what was a combat round! I knew only about turns: move, attack, end of the turn... and wondering why the PO could move, attack and move again! :(

We agrred with 3 TOs and I called in as most troops as I could: 1 PZ Army, 19 Pz Div together with south deployment. After some more detailed reading (and even before my turn) I had already regreted about the 19 Pz Div instead of Thunderclap. Now, after seeing what the artillery attacks could do Soviets troops around the pocket, I regreted from my second TO... I think that it would have been better to go for center deployment.

Anyway, it is gonna be fun and educational! I learned about combat rounds, probe attacks to call in arty support and how to make a better usage of the air units... got 247 kills against 42 in turn 2 (still 3x1 if we take the average pilot's excess multiplier of 2). I have a few questions today (just some of the many others that will come in the future):

1. Is it a better practice to split units to cover more area and avoid encirclements or not? What you guys usually do when defending and when attacking?
2. In a rescue like this one, would it be better to use Ignore losses in the 57 Pz Korp? What is the possible impact in combat rounds?
3. Any suggestions on how to set an efficient defense line in the north? I don't expect the Italians to hold ground. Should I set them to minimize losses and let them withdraw spending the Soviets MP or should I set them to ignore losses and try to slow the enemy as much as possible ( on the risk of evaporation)?

I know that some of the answers for these questions may be your secret for success, so I will understand if I get no answers... :rolleyes:

Thanks for any help!

Conao

[KG_RangerBooBoo]

Don't feel too qualified to answer as I feel like a newbie myself but I did set my Italians to ignore losses after digging them in. It seemed to work for quite a few turns as my opponent was only able to make minimum breakthroughs and I was able to use my Germans to encircle and destroy many of his penetrations. I can understand your eye opening as I went through the same educational process when I first started.

[MikeJ]

so far I have learned more than in the last almost two years I've been playing COW against the PO!

The PO is about as good as a blind person would be playing TOAW :). The best way to learn is to play a human and see what they do (or just ask endless numbers of questions ;)).

Is it a better practice to split units to cover more area and avoid encirclements or not? What you guys usually do when defending and when attacking?

I don't think there's a better way, it would usualy depend on the situation... for example.. if you have Italians... don't even bother splitting them if you want to hold territory...

I think you just need to evaluate whether or not the broken down unit will be able to stand its ground for more than 1 or 2 combat rounds.

I personally prefer not breaking units down if I can help it, because it's usually easier to beat through 3 small units than 1 large one.


2. In a rescue like this one, would it be better to use Ignore losses in the 57 Pz Korp? What is the possible impact in combat rounds?

I typically use limit/minimize loss attacks to dig out units then I usually use ignore losses for the heavy assaults to seize the hex.

There is almost never a good time to use ignore losses on entrenched/fortified units, even if they are very small. Dig them out with light attacks first or you will burn many combat rounds.

I usually use ignore losses on any units that are dug out, unless my attacking force isn't strong enough. It will ensure your attackers don't break off prematurely (which will ensure heavier losses on the enemy units). Just make sure you can win the combat if you use ignore losses (and again - not on anything that is entrenched or fortified - defending status you *might* be able to get away with).

One of the key reasons to use ignore losses on attacks where you intend to take the hex, is that it keeps the unit(s) you want to advance into the hex in the fight so that they will advance once the enemy has been routed. If you used limit or minimize losses, they might not advance as it's possible the first casualties inflicted by the defenders would force these units to break off (during combat calculations, defenders use their anti-personnel/tank weapons first - then the attackers). The reason this is important is because a unit that moves into an enemy hex after the enemy has been routed uses the attack time to move into the hex.

So for example: you are attacking an enemy unit on a road. Your unit has 10 of 10 movement points. You resolve the attack and the enemy retreats after two combat rounds and your unit occupies the hex. 2 combat rounds out of 10 means 80% of the turn remains. Since advancing on the road would only take your unit 2 movement points, it will have 8 of 10 movement points and have advanced a hex. In other words, it is in position to attack again immediately without "wasting" any rounds at all. This is how you can make those deep penetrations in one turn. Now, keep in mind that it only works on certain terrain (if the hex you moved into needed 3 MPs, the unit would have 7 of 10 MPs left after the attack). But it still saves you the 2 MPs you would have otherwise needed, because if your unit did not advance into the hex after the attack it would have 8 of 10 MPs and would require 3 more to move into that hex (leaving it with 5 MPs). So you can make use of the combat time to move units and keep a fast pace going.

Another interesting bonus to this is that zones of control are ignored when advancing after combat.


3. Any suggestions on how to set an efficient defense line in the north? I don't expect the Italians to hold ground. Should I set them to minimize losses and let them withdraw spending the Soviets MP or should I set them to ignore losses and try to slow the enemy as much as possible ( on the risk of evaporation)?

I almost always have defending units on ignore losses... I think the only time I don't is for HQ units or artillery units, etc... or if I have a unit that is severely weakened but I had no choice to throw it into the line, I might put them on limited losses. Units that aren't dug in are very easy to attack and anytime a unit retreats, it's in mobile status. Once the Soviet player makes a few attacks he can just overrun (retreat before combat) your Italians units over and over right into your rear. IMO that's a bad thing.

Personally I just dig them in and see how much time they can buy. Fortunately I'm not faced with that choice, since Germans hold most of the line on the Italian sector in my game... but if I am forced to retreat, the Italians will be my sacrificial rear guard. I am digging them in on key hexes all over my rear and keeping some near the front to be a one turn speed bump so I can withdraw my infantry and get away from Soviet mobile troops...

Hope this helps.

[Furocity]

Welcome, and good luck with destroying the Soviet hordes.

Defense in the North with the Italians: dig them in, augment them with german infantry division, employ a defense in depth, and make him pay for every kilimoter he gains. I sent 4 german infantry divisions to aid the Italians, I am on turn 20 and so far no major breakthroughs. I also sent 5th SS Motorized Rifle Division north to counter attack and Soviet successful penetrations. So, defense in depth, augmented with German Infantry, and a mobile reserve to seal off any pentrations.

Splitting units: I do it when I feel I need to: break contact with the enemy, establish a defense in depth (have dug in positions waiting for retreating units), also to create a weak point in my line in order to draw the enemy in so I can encircle and destroy any foolish Soviet units.

Deployment of 19th PZ Div: I sent them to the center to conduct a supporting attack towards the pocket while 57th PZ Corps launched attacks in the south towards the pocket (main effort). In effect he was not suspecting this, since 19th PZ Div enters in the Northern sector.

57th PZ Corp on ignore losses: NO, keep min, enircle, and destroy Soviet forces. You need to get to the pocket as fast as possbile, before the Soviets can establish a dug in defense west of the pocket. On ignore you will burn up 3 combat rds, units tend to attack suicide (so you will burn up more rounds) and if you ignore on Fortified positions you will burn up even more combat rounds and have high casualities. As the game progresses, you will notice the losses, especially since the Axis replacement and the pestilicence factors will have an impact.

GL