Combined Organization Penalty

[ebitt]

I have been trying Jon Sowden's excellent scenario for the Normandy'44 Campaign and I have had problems with the Combined Organization penalty when attempting assaults. The manual says:
"While the penalty applies when corps-level forces from different corps combine in an assault attack, it does not apply when corps-level forces combine with forces from a division within that corps."

The Engineer battalions on Omaha and Utah are part of the Corps organization, but when adding them to the assault by the Division I always get the penalty. Is the manual incorrect, or am I doing something wrong?

Ed

[Glenn Saunders]

I have been trying Jon Sowden's excellent scenario for the Normandy'44 Campaign and I have had problems with the Combined Organization penalty when attempting assaults. The manual says:
"While the penalty applies when corps-level forces from different corps combine in an assault attack, it does not apply when corps-level forces combine with forces from a division within that corps."

The Engineer battalions on Omaha and Utah are part of the Corps organization, but when adding them to the assault by the Division I always get the penalty. Is the manual incorrect, or am I doing something wrong?

Ed

Ed:

I just checked the BASIC Game engine using the newest release and the combined Org Penalty seems to be working as the manual suggests it should using OObs provided by the game.

So while I am not certain, I suspect if you are seeing something different with somebody elses user created scns, then it might be something with how that OOB is structured.

If you care to try a scn that came with the game and see if that seems to work for you - that would be the best way to check this.

If you find a case where you thnk it is broken using the default game, then send the BTL file and the hex Id with the info to HPS Support and the situation can be easily reviewed while comparing "Apples to Apples" with the file you provide.

Glenn

[ebitt]

Thanks for the prompt reply. I have to admit I have only checked it with custom scenarios, and it seems that if the Corps units are included as subordinate units to a larger HQ (such as a Bde HQ) then the problem occurs. If I move the units out of that structure and make them seperate Battalions then no problem.

Ed

[Glenn Saunders]

...if the Corps units are included as subordinate units to a larger HQ (such as a Bde HQ) ....



In this case they would no longer be considered Corps units. That is the game can tell which unit is a Corps Troop unit except by reading the OOB where the units sit in relation to the various HQs.

That is if the Corps unit has been moving in the OOB and is now under a Bde HQ, then it is a unit of the Bde and no longer a Corps Unit. And this situation won't happen in game default OOBs.

Glenn

[ebitt]

http://www.blbhive.demon.co.uk/VCorpsOOB.jpg
This is the V Corps organization as presented by the OOB Editor. If I understand your reply, then neither Eng Bde are Corps troops. Granted this is a custom scenario, but shouldn't anything below Division be considered a Corps unit? The Ranger Bns don't give the Penalty warning but any Engineer battalion in the Brigades do.

[Glenn Saunders]

http://www.blbhive.demon.co.uk/VCorpsOOB.jpg
This is the V Corps organization as presented by the OOB Editor. If I understand your reply, then neither Eng Bde are Corps troops. Granted this is a custom scenario, but shouldn't anything below Division be considered a Corps unit? The Ranger Bns don't give the Penalty warning but any Engineer battalion in the Brigades do.

The Engs in the default OOB of V Corps work fine - no combined arms penalty - thus, I suspect the issue might be related to the Bde status in Jons OOB.

Glenn

[ebitt]

The Engs in the default OOB of V Corps work fine - no combined arms penalty - thus, I suspect the issue might be related to the Bde status in Jons OOB.

Per your suggestion I tried the Omaha scenario included with the game and there was no penalty. Looking at the OOB in the editor, the Engineer Bns are grouped in a Bde-like structure but there is no HQ unit. So, while the Bde HQ is nice historically, it serves no function as the units will never fight as a Bde and effect is to cause the penalty.

Thanks

Ed