View Full Version : JoeBob vs. Bruce
Our game has begun. I wouldn't budge on the number of TO's (2), so we have defaulted to historical (2nd north, and little Saturn probably on turn 5).
I triggered 2nd north immediately, so I'm assuming they will show up on Turn 2? (I didn't see them on the map, although the TO states they become available on turn 1)
Also assuming I can wait and pull the trigger on little Saturn on turn 5. (in other words I don't need to push that particular TO button yet)
JoeBob :devil:
CyberRanger
17 Mar 04, 15:29
Our game has begun. I wouldn't budge on the number of TO's (2), so we have defaulted to historical (2nd north, and little Saturn probably on turn 5).
I triggered 2nd north immediately, so I'm assuming they will show up on Turn 2? (I didn't see them on the map, although the TO states they become available on turn 1)
Also assuming I can wait and pull the trigger on little Saturn on turn 5. (in other words I don't need to push that particular TO button yet)
JoeBob :devil:
So what did he want? 3 TO's?
Yes, the 2nd Gd will deploy on turn 2. Pull the Little Saturn trigger on turn 4 .. that makes it effective on turn 5. That's a historical game.
Ya, he wanted 3 TO's pretty bad. He joked about having to settle for historical. As team CO, I think that means that the Axis players feel 3 TO's will give them the upperhand. I recommend having ALL our players to push for 2 TO's with historical as a default.
Like you mentioned before, Brent, the object is to WIN this tourney!
Bruce hit me pretty hard, hammering all my airfields (only one unit not reorganizing), using supply drain attacks on all units adjacent to the pocket, and got in 5 combat rounds. Not good...
We are playing historical.
I got in two combat rounds, trying to hammer his line from north to south, and achieving minor breakthroughs against the Italians, and German security units. I squeezed the pocket, trying to wear him down, but not as much as he hurt me.
57 Panzer and friends are driving toward the pocket, and will probably connect in 2 turns. I'm trying to screen him off but only have one mech division free to try and hold him off.
I think i'm holding my own, all things considered. Little Saturn will commence on turn 4. Does anybody have any thoughts. What can I expect for the next few turns? Am I positioning myself correctly. Any comments will help.
My turn 2 EOT file should be downloadable.
JoeBob :angry:
Let's try uploading again... :(
Whoops, looks like I have to zip it and all I have is WinZip evaluation version.
Odd I can't upload a .PBL or .SAV or .SAL file.
Any freeware out there I can download to zip files?
Or, I can send the file to anyone interested.
laszlo.nemedi
21 Mar 04, 01:09
winzip evaluation should work, but you can send me...
Thank you, Laszlo!
Turns out the evaluation version does quite a bit. File now available for anyone who wants a peek.
;)
laszlo.nemedi
21 Mar 04, 01:29
I saw your counter attack in the center, and south seems getting consolidated (be careful many weak points there).
Again dug in ignore losses!
I think your opponent somehow weaker than you so you have big chances when you start little saturn (or what).
He will lost the selfconfidence then and you can be the hunter...
Interesting - seems to be a battle of North v South.
I think you'll do fine in this one !
Sent off turn 3, got 2 solid combat rounds in.
Had a pretty hilarious event. I've been bombarding his airfield hex with long range artillery (152's and 8 inchers), trying to wipe out some aircraft, and it turns out the Von Paulus HQ unit was located there. It evap'd on the first combat round!
I assasinated Von Paulus with about 100 tubes of heavy artillery!!! :D
Now I wonder if this will give me any VP's and/or cause a major unit reorg?
Keeping pressure on the north, buckling the Italian line, can't wait for little Saturn to trigger.
The Stalingrad pocket got hammered some more this turn, but the danger of a linkup from 57th Panzer still exists. It could happen on his next turn if he has some good luck.
When do my Don reinforcements arrive?
CyberRanger
27 Mar 04, 08:17
... It evap'd on the first combat round!
I assasinated Von Paulus with about 100 tubes of heavy artillery!!! :D
...
When do my Don reinforcements arrive?Great luck! I need to try that.
Don Front reinforcements arrival varies ... I think from turn 5 until up to 8. I don't know the %'s.
laszlo.nemedi
27 Mar 04, 08:48
In my mirror test play Pelle hit Paulus by airforce by luck, too...
Panzerpelle
28 Mar 04, 07:04
In my mirror test play Pelle hit Paulus by airforce by luck, too...
That was really fun...ny...
laszlo.nemedi
28 Mar 04, 08:07
That was really fun...ny...
:mad: :mad: :mad:
After another 3 rounds of Bruce bashing on me, he still has not linked up with the pocket, but it does appear inevitable.
Triggered Little Saturn at the beginning of turn, and turned loose "the dogs", to attack the Italians and Rumanians en masse.
Got in two combat rounds, and pushed heavily into his lines up north, and also pounded the Stalingrad pocket with some effect.
I am worried about my vulnerability in the center, and my general weakness in the south.
Any thoughts about what I should do now? Can I expect major reinforcements to deal with the threat of his panzer forces in the south?
Does he have major reserves that he can suprise me with?
We are playing historical. Any input would be helpful.
File is attached.
Hi JoeBob,
Your situation looks pretty good. It looks like he gave Don Front a pounding, but he stepped onto the release line, so that's as good as the TO for Don Front elsewhere. Some notes,
1. Never put your HQ's on the front line if you can avoid it. (83, 29) losing it cuts the prof. of units in that formation by half.
2. Do what you can to reinforce 5th TA in its drive to Morozovsk. Perhaps bring 1st Mech Corp toward Petrovka so units there can redeploy. Looks like your 5th TA is doing really good otherwise, but 5th TA lacks staying power in the face of determined counterattacks.
3. Continue as you are with the Northern and Southern Offensives, looks like you are doing pretty good with both.
4. Most everyone is finding it difficult to contend with 57th PzK wherever it appears. If it appears inevitable, and in your estimation you cannot stop the linkup between 57th PzK and Sixth Army, try to pull some of the units in front of the steam roller to shore up your flanks. Getting hit from both front and rear, as it looks like he can start to do in T5 will not bode well for your containment effort.
5. Pull your AA into defensive positions. They are doing next to nothing in deflecting strikes on airbases. They have reasonable prof., and the 76 and 37 AA guns are good AT assets.
6. If you are worried about the Brandenberg unit dropping to cut supply, you will only really need garrisons on the supply points, and even then, only the most important ones. We have several. Odds are he won't be able to cut supply entirely to anything, at least with the commandoes. That might free up a few regiments.
7. Don't be afraid to take some good swipes at the Germans holding lines near the Italians. They will fold with a few good stabs.
8. Relative to South Front...you won't have to contend with 1st PzA, but keep an eye out for rail movement and when you see it, keep an eye on unit designations. 19th PzD will show up eventually, he's got some Infantry, Ostlegionen and the like that could be sent to help the Romanians. Might be worthwhile to consider using 28th Army as a draw to siphon off any reserves he may send to help the Italians. Hard choice there, but it is vulnerable -- and isolated.
Main choice is whether to engage as best as you can to prevent a linkup with the pocket, or engage to pull some of these units from Don Front to decrease 28th Army's exposure.
Other major consideration with 5th TA, if you can press forward 1 more hex, is to bring down some of the horsedrawn arty, or HQ's with a range of 4 and start dropping shells on his precious Luftewaffe.
Looks pretty good, be wary of counterattacks..it looks like he's doing the ant thing and if he's being aggressive, he will like strike back at 1st-3rd Gds + 6th A with ant attacks. Don't hesitate to do the same thing back to him.
Good Job!
plutonico
31 Mar 04, 08:35
but wahts is ant atacks?
Ant attacks are attacks conducted with the smallest possible unit, breaking the regiments down to battalions, breaking battalions into companies, and so forth. This is particularly effectively in conjunction with loads of artillery in support being able to generate "disproportionate" losses.
Actually, in some regards, I don't think they're disproportionate, considering the relative uselessness of direct preliminary bombardments.
Thanks for the excellent analysis!
I didn't realize the HQ's were so vulnerable and that their loss would cause the proficiency of the formation to drop by 50%. Is that in terms of attack/defense, or just efficiency of supply?
Also, Bruce dropped Brandenburgers on turn 1 and I wiped them out. Does he have more? I have been concerned about paradrops on supply.
Are my flak units completely ineffective? I thought they might help absorb losses from when he conducts airbase attacks.
And yes, I've been eyeing those Luftwaffe bases, but dont' want to bring up the 4 hex artillery until it's a little safer.
Thanks again!
:cheeky:
Southern Dandy
31 Mar 04, 23:27
Thanks for the excellent analysis!
I didn't realize the HQ's were so vulnerable and that their loss would cause the proficiency of the formation to drop by 50%. Is that in terms of attack/defense, or just efficiency of supply?
Also, Bruce dropped Brandenburgers on turn 1 and I wiped them out. Does he have more? I have been concerned about paradrops on supply.
Are my flak units completely ineffective? I thought they might help absorb losses from when he conducts airbase attacks.
And yes, I've been eyeing those Luftwaffe bases, but dont' want to bring up the 4 hex artillery until it's a little safer.
Thanks again!
:cheeky:
Answering these, hopefully in order....
That 50% loss applies to attack and defense. There's a certain logic to follow- first, if a formation lets it HQ get wiped out, that formation must not be that good anyway; second, without its HQ to put orders from higher up into perspective (and help distribute supply, etc), that formation will be more 'confused' than its neighbors as to its task in the grand scheme of things.
The Axis has one battalion of Brandenbergers available. Most of the .SALs I've seen, as well as my own game, show that our Axis friends are splitting this unit into 3 companies before dropping them. Without seeing a .SAL from the turn you killed them, before you killed them, I can't say for certain...but if you remember the unit size in question, you'll have your answer.
If you don't remember...they're based at the start of the game at the Axis controlled airfield closest to the pocket south and east of the Don (in the area LVII PzK deployed in your game)...if you're theater recon assets have observed that airfield, and Bruce hasn't moved them, you'll be able to see if any components of that unit is still there or not. Also, they don't reconstitute...and if they did, they'd be incapable of airborne operations anyway.
Careful and controlled experimentation (I can't remember if it was here at HQ or over at TDG...Brent? Pelle? anyone remember?) has shown that the flak units are about effective as they were historically in downing/damaging aircraft. In TOAW terms though, they're pretty useless, since downing 1 or 2 aircraft out of 500 (an exaggeration, but not by much) and failing to otherwise break up an aerial attack is meaningless to the attacker, and painful to the defender, in the grand scheme of things.
I think that's it for now...and for me tonight. Gotta get some sleep! I have a big day in southeast Russia tomorrow! :D
Ivan
Operation Little Saturn began this turn, and at first it looked like I would only get 2 combat rounds, since my first round used up 40% of my turn.
My first combat round was carefully planned with all units attacking on minimize losses, and artillery on limit losses. The results I got were relatively weak. I thought so much for shock effect...especially burning almost half my turn for limited results.
My second combat round I went for broke with units attacking on limit losses, and sometimes ignore losses for vital hexes, with all artillery on ignore losses. I hammered his lines from north to south. And guess what? After all was said and done, I still had 50% of the turn left!!!
It HAD to have been the shock effect. :D
So I went after Bruce with a vengeance for 3 more combat rounds with whatever ground units hadn't already been dug in or had enough movement points to advance and/or attack.
The northern line manned by the Italians has been trashed. The Rumanians in the north, as well as some of the Germans also got hit hard. The Stalingrad pocket really got hammered with incessant artillery attacks and a LOT of evap's. The southern Rumanians also got slapped around a bit, but not as much as I would have liked.
I restored the line around the pocket to two units depth, fortified. He may still break through this turn, however, but elsewhere he MUST have some major concerns, unless I'm missing something.
1st Mech Guards has been dispatched to try and make a drive for his airfields and rail-line at Morozovsk. I suspect he can seem them approaching but what can he do about it? I also sent 18th Tank Corps all the way south to try and shore up 3rd Guards CavCorps which I'm afraid he may attack in force with 57 PzCorps. It's a long drive but he won't be expecting the company, I hope! :surprise:
18th Tank Corps could be a debatable strategy, but the north seems pretty secure, so why not use them in the south, where i'm the weakest.
Again, if anyone wishes to view the file, I am interested to know if he has significant reserves I may be missing. Don't want any unpleasant suprises! Seems like Bruce is pretty dedicated to rescuing the pocket.
Game ON!
JoeBob :mad:
Southern Dandy
12 Apr 04, 08:31
Hi!
Looked over your file Friday, haven't had a chance to sit down and post my impressions until this morning. Having said that....
Your biggest concern was about major reserves that you don't know about. This scenario makes it difficult for both sides to maintain much of even a local reserve, nevermind a general, strategic reserve. Based on what I saw in your .SAL, the only significant forces still not in action for Bruce are 19th PzD and 1st PzA.
Because you're playing a historical version, 1st PzA will begin arriving near Rostov around 27 Dec '42. I can't say for certain without reopening the game what turn that happens to be, but it would be easy enough for you to figure out. That formation has 5 divisions in it- 16th motorized, 111th ID, 3rd PzD, 7th PzD, and 5th SS PzD. Usually there's a line in the "recent news" dialogue at the start of the turn about 1st PzA's arrival, plus you can watch for lots of activity near Rostov.
19th PzD should arrive around turn 14 or so. I'm not sure what date that is, compared to 1st PzA, but there may or may not be a ment9ion of it in the recent news dialogue. It arrives on the northernmost Axis controlled railline on the western edge of the map, so if you see lots of activity out that way on the playback on turn 14, there it is....
Now that I think about it a little bit, the lead elements of 1st PzA and 19th PzD may arrive simultaneously, for all intents, in theater.
Anyhow, keep pushing those Italians back, ideally you can evap them outright. It will force Bruce to immediately commit those newly arriving forces, and possibly divert forces from the relief effort as well, to re-establish a somewhat coherent front...and keep his reserve to a minimum.
The nightmare situation in this scenario for the Axis player is an ever-lengthening front- they just don't have the units to plug into it without become dreadfully weak somewhere...which allows you to punch another hole in the line and creating a pretty vicious cycle.
Otherwise, you're holding Bruce off pretty well....having played him in the past, I know he's about impossible to stop once he decides he's going somewhere!
John
John, thanks for the excellent evaluation!
I now know what's coming down the pipeline. I suspect when his Panzer Army arrives from the Caucusus, that 44th Army will be on it's heels...
Also, wonder when the Don Reinforcemnts arrive. Will they be listed in the reinforcements queue, or are they event-triggered?
Got Bruce's turn 6. He is one hex away from breaking through with a battalion of Tigers. His efforts to regain his positions in the pocket cost him a lot of unit evap's. He is also trying to pull back the Italians and Rumanians and reform his line.
My turn 6 produced 4 combat rounds, and I really mauled him up north. He has some major problems now, with units evap'ing, and others on the verge of encirclement.
Hammered him in the pocket again with reduced effect, but some units were knocked back, and I've taken a few more hexes. Tried to drive off his 57 PzK Tigers, with some Shermans believe it or not, and two of the three companies retreated. Good chance he will finally link up on his turn 7. Hopefully I can counterattack and close the opening before his next supply phase.
I'm on the verge of breaking out with 1st Guards Mech Corps towars Morozovsk, and 18th Tank Corps is now waiting in the wings behind 1st Guards.
Looking good, just wish I could stop 57 PzK from cracking the pocket.
Steve
CyberRanger
13 Apr 04, 06:29
... Also, wonder when the Don Reinforcemnts arrive. Will they be listed in the reinforcements queue, or are they event-triggered?
The Don Reinforcements arrive on turn 30 in a historical game.
plutonico
13 Apr 04, 07:28
from morozovsk to the north he has all their fronts broken¡¡
congratulations
plutonico
Southern Dandy
13 Apr 04, 12:00
The difference between turns is often staggering.....and this was the case here!
Phenomenal progress up north- I'd suggest bypassing that lone armored train in Kantimirokova- it'll be stuck there the rest of the game. You can always use later reinforcements to reduce it to grab those 2 VPs, which should go a bit easier after its been out of supply for a while.
I suggest screening off the other two east of Morozovsk as well. Break down a couple of divisions to keep the elements of the LFDs with them in place....
You done a nice job collapsing the pocket from the north. I'd suggest that you try to roll up the flanks of his SW line in the kessel, closest to LVII PzK, as best you can. It will complicate his relief effort even more, and put additional pressure on him within the kessel. He may still yet link up, but looking at the "health indicator" lights of LVII PzK units, they're exhausted...mostly orange and red. If he does, it won't be a strong or wide corridor, which should allow you to shut it down again with relative ease. Also, try and grab Gumrak ASAP- that's his only supply inside the kessel.
Everywhere else on the board....you have 8-12 turns by my estimation of open and broken field running before 1st PzA and 19th PzD arrive. Push hard everywhere....you may not get to Voroshilovgrad, but try anyway!
With a little bit of luck, you could push all the way to the Axis rail head and supply point at 0,8- if you occupy that hex is 5 or so turns, 19th PzD may not ever appear on the map! You probably won't get there, given the road net and awful terrain, but with some help by Italians RBCing, you just might pull it off.
Also, remember that the super rivers, shallow water, and marsh hexes (regular and flooded) will freeze over on turn 15. Don't want you to get surprised, and ideally you can surprise him and bypass defenses based on bridges later on.
All in all, a terrific job against a tough opponent!
Ivan
Well like John said, things happen quickly...
I've skipped a turn here, so here's the update.
Bruce's northern front is virtually obliterated. Italian units are getting hard to find. This next turn I may be able to drive unhindered all over the area. :cheeky:
Millerovo has got to be VERY worried with two Guards Armies bearing down on it.
Morozovsk is being fought over, but the rail line has been cut. Otherwise our forces in the area there appear to be roughly equal.
There is bad news however, as the Kessel was broken open and cannot be closed. He IS stretched, but I'm starting to think he may not simpy drain the pocket and run, but decide to try and "flip" Don Front on it's back with 57 PzK. I AM very stretched around the pocket and am starting to go over to the defensive. I will probably have to divert one of the Guards Armies to rescue Don Front if he persists.
28th Army (if you can call it that...), is now endangered itself from Rumainian and PzK elemnents swinging south. With no scheduled reinforcements, 28th Army only gets weaker. I'm very vulnerable there.
I do have a plan (sort of). 3rd Guards Army will strike at Morozovsk and try to completely break his flank there and rush towards the Don to cut of PzK and 6th ARmy. At the very least he will have a LOT to worry about.
Secondly, one of the now "spare" Guards Armies can be sent to the Kessel to reinforce Don Front units before disaster can befall them.
Suggestions, comments welcome!
JoeBob :D
Hi JoeBob,
Except for the situation south of Stalingrad, things look really good.
Instead of reinforcing Don Front, it would be worthwhile to consider capitalizing on all the places where his strongest troops "are not". Not sure what theatre recon is not picking up West of Morozovsk, but the objectives are worth 60 VP. Additionally, if you have 44th Army coming in shortly, you will be within very close striking distance of another 35 VP. With the 14 VP you already have, that should be an OV.
In that consideration, it may just be a question of a) keeping his reinforcements isolated from the rest of his army, and b) drive a line S of Morozovsk keeping 57th PzK, 6th Armee and the rest east of it.
The axis wants you to divert forces away from major objectives. The Axis plan only works if you let it and if you don't Axis forces will be out of position for keeping everything except Stalingrad and surrounding VP's.
32 turns is a lot of time though.
Good Luck!
Intense scenario... :surprise:
His Northern defenses are essentially gone with almost all the units (mostly Italians, Rumanians, and a few Krauts) rounded up and wiped out.
I managed to occupy the hex at (0, 8) with a tank battalion, and other tank battalions occupying adjoining hexes. I'm hoping this will prevent his PzD reinforcement from coming on there. If it does anyway... :whist:
I've started attacking across the Don and am only two long hexes away from Voroshivilograd (I can NEVER pronounce that name!). The weight of the Soviet Army is about to pressure him there.
Consolidated Morosovsk, and am continuing to push South trying to break his left flank there. I'm going to enjoy wiping out the Rumanian 1st Armored Division (while isolated).
That's the good news...
The Kessel continues to be a harsh place but I'm not giving up ground easily. He has to fight hard for every fortified hex, and some of his 6th Army units evap every turn on his attack.
28th Army is in serious jeopardy, but I formed a hasty defensive line that might just hold long enough to make him reconsider. Especially when 44th Army shows up.
Big question now is whether I can take Vorosh$@%^$grad before he has time to reinforce.
Oh ya, he dropped a friggin Brandenburger after it was intercepted 4 times without damage, and landed on an airfield. I am sending units to head him off, but I'm sure he'll just fly to another airfield next turn.
Quite the rollercoaster! Having a blast in the north and to some extent in the center, but the south is a nailbiter!
Game ON! :smoke:
Learning to drink vodka martinis... :drink:
Check out the zip!
Southern Dandy
20 May 04, 07:37
I managed to occupy the hex at (0, 8) with a tank battalion, and other tank battalions occupying adjoining hexes. I'm hoping this will prevent his PzD reinforcement from coming on there. If it does anyway... :whist:
I may be mistaken, but for some reason I think that units scheduled to appear on a map-edge hex as reinforcements can appear up to 2 hexes away from their arrival hex, if that arrival hex is occupied. In otherwords, if I'm understanding the game mechanics correctly, you'd need to occupy each hex between (0,6) and (0,10) to prevent 19th PzD and subsequent reinforcements from arriving in that area.
Does anyone else know for certain one way or the other how that works? I think I have it right....but it is early in the morning......and I'm not caffeinated yet! :nuts:
More comments likely to follow after I DL the file and give it peek....
John
CyberRanger
20 May 04, 08:23
Fascinating battle! I'd say you are doing great. You are at -88 on turn 12. That's very good! He seems to be hoping that he can destroy 28th Army in the south and then redeploy his forces from there to hold Stalingrad and points to the SW.
But the 28th Army holds no VP's for him. Meanwhile, you are gaining important VP's to the west. I see his forces becoming trapped in one HUGE pocket along the lines of the original Soviet plan.
CyberRanger
20 May 04, 08:30
..
Does anyone else know for certain one way or the other how that works? I think I have it right....but it is early in the morning.....
Here's a thread (http://www.warfarehq.com/forums/showthread.php?p=41408&highlight=reinforcement+arrival#post41408) that discusses it some ... but only finishes with
Here are a couple of posts I made a couple of months ago on the TDG site when the same subject came up:
...3. New units (reinforcements) would only shift their arrival hex if they were scheduled to arrive on a map edge. And I furthermore found that the North map edge didn't share this feature, unlike the South, East, and West edges. This seems to be the direct opposite of Jarek's experience, so some, yet undiscovered, factor may toggle this fact.
...
still searching for more information!
Well, i have a total of 6 tank battalions at the west map edge which means I can lay a screen of 5 units centered on (0,8), and have one in reserve (like he can really do anything if a PzD shows up anyway!).
I hope this works! :surprise:
If it doesn't I'll have to peel off some of my advance units to reinforce and slow him down...
Guess I'll know in a couple of turns.
Thanks guys for the quick input! :cheeky:
JoeBob
Southern Dandy
27 May 04, 11:21
Hi again--
For what it may be worth, there's additional arrival hexes for his reinforcements still to your south. Offhand, I can tell you that an infantry division arrives at (1,37) on turn 25. That may be a little far for you to get extended to, but the reward may be worth the risk.
Without peeking at the Axis reinforcement schedule a little more closely, I can't give you more information than that right now...but I'll come back edit this with more info if and when I get the chance.
John
Finally completed my Soviet turn 13.
I am continuing my advance to the south with 1st Guards Army which is coming to a halt in front of Voroshivilograd. I've established one river crossing already and more engineers will be throwing down bridges next turn. If his reinforcements don't arrive in 2 turns, I should have the city bagged by then.
All of his lines seem stretched to the breaking point, and even 28th Army in the deep south managed an effective counterattack this turn, rolling up some motorized regiments that were the point of his attack down there.
Bruce still seems intent on keeping and expanding the Kessel, which is pushing me to the breaking point, but reinforcement are enroute to try and contain any breakthroughs. I did manage to drive him out of Stalingrad, but couldn't occupy it, so it remains (for a moment) an open city.
On the west edge of the map, it looks like his PzD is starting to arrive. I was one turn short on sealing off his arrival there. Looks like I will have some major flank issues arising there.
Any input would be appreciated. I feel like I'm turning the corner on Bruce, but 1st PzA hasn't arrived yet, so I guess we'll just have to wait and see.
Thanks in advance,
JoeBob :devil:
CyberRanger
16 Jun 04, 13:04
I think you are doing an excellent job. Bruce seems so focused on the Kessel that he's losing site of the bigger battle. Your progress in the west is fantastic.
My priorities would be:
Capture Tatsynskaka (43,35). The Germans have a supply point there. It also cuts the main east/west rail and road.
Capture the supply point at 0,30. Once you have both these supply points, the Germans are set for serious supply problems!
Once you have these two supply points, drive SOUTH for Rostov.
Once Rostov is captured, clean up the mini-pocket of your choice. I'd say do Voroshilograd first, then Stalingrad
plutonico
17 Jun 04, 05:02
i think that your situation is great¡¡
trying to made a big-big new kessel?
only one advice, i think that ruskis must to risk all time of the game, without thinking about loss some units. I think that in this game, the stability help to axis player. so hurry, advance and advance, dont think¡¡
plutonico
(someone understand my english (i am not))
laszlo.nemedi
17 Jun 04, 06:51
i think that your situation is great¡¡
trying to made a big-big new kessel?
only one advice, i think that ruskis must to risk all time of the game, without thinking about loss some units. I think that in this game, the stability help to axis player. so hurry, advance and advance, dont think¡¡
plutonico
(someone understand my english (i am not))
Maybe I have an advantage as I am not English speaker, too, so I can clearly understand you and I agree :D
CyberRanger
17 Jun 04, 07:45
...so hurry, advance and advance, dont think¡¡
I agree Big-Big! Once you have your plan, go all out, never stop just to re-supply!
Believe me I am trying to advance as quickly as possible, but the friggin' Axis units keep trying to get in my way! :nuts:
As for Plutonico, yes your English is just fine, I am understanding what you are saying, so thanks!
Bruce is welcome to hang out in the Kessel as long as he wishes!
:devil:
Yes, Stalingrad fell to me on the last combat round of the turn with a brigade of Lend-Lease Shermans and Stuarts occupying the city (but no time to dig in). Confusion of both sides must be abounding...
Not likely to keep the hex, but maybe this will convince Bruce to start withdrawing from the Kessel. I also moved adjacent to Gumrak this turn, which may further help with the convincing process.
Vorosh almost fell this turn as well, with the crossing of the Don successful, and I'm now adjacent from two hexes. Strangely, Vorosh is empty, the Axis units now fled. Looks like I will gain the prize!!!
His PzD on the western edge of the board is still trying to come on, but I'm gradually surrounding it.
Looking good for the Ruskies!!!
:cheeky:
Of course, 1st PzA is about to arrive I believe...
:surprise:
CyberRanger
21 Jun 04, 08:15
His PzD on the western edge of the board is still trying to come on, but I'm gradually surrounding it.
Looking good for the Ruskies!!!
:cheeky:
Of course, 1st PzA is about to arrive I believe...
:surprise:
Bruce is fighting an "interesting" battle. I'm not sure what he hopes to gain by keeping so many units in the kessel, especially when he lets Stalingrad fall! Looks like his attacks in the SE are losing steam.
The fall of Voro is great and the fall of Tatsynskaya even better. I swear that hex is an Axis supply point although sometimes no supply symbol shows.
On the western edge with that PzD, how did that work as far as trying to block the reinforcement hexes?
WestPointer,
The PzD reinforcements starting showing up in the (0,7) hex, instead of the (0,8) hex. All the other hexes had been occupied by me previously, I just didn't have the remaining movement to occupy the other hex since it was hills, and then of course his guys started showing up.
Now I'm hoping I can keep him there, or even evap the stack if I get lucky.
I'm assuming the worst, so I've started diverting some forces to try and contain him if he breaks out.
One other note: It's a little embarassing but I can't figure out how to "cut and paste" other players quotes, which is commonly done. Can I get a quick tutorial on that.
Dohhhh!!! :eek:
laszlo.nemedi
21 Jun 04, 14:39
...
One other note: It's a little embarassing but I can't figure out how to "cut and paste" other players quotes, which is commonly done. Can I get a quick tutorial on that.
Dohhhh!!! :eek:
You mean the "quote" button at every posts?? :nuts:
You mean the "quote" button at every posts?? :nuts:
Whoahhh! Think I may have discovered it...
Thanks!
:clap: :joy: :hail:
laszlo.nemedi
22 Jun 04, 04:43
Whoahhh! Think I may have discovered it...
Thanks!
:clap: :joy: :hail:
Clever boy! :D :p
Clever boy! :D :p
Hey Laszlo, if you have so much time your hands (busy goofing on me...), then how about getting out your Sealion tourney turn?
Huh, huh? :bounce:
I'm just a glutton for punishment! :violin:
laszlo.nemedi
23 Jun 04, 09:21
Hey Laszlo, if you have so much time your hands (busy goofing on me...), then how about getting out your Sealion tourney turn?
Huh, huh? :bounce:
I'm just a glutton for punishment! :violin:
So you would like to push me to get the turn out in a hurry??? No way!
(I can do the turn on Friday, sorry :D
Just sent off T16 to Bruce.
He managed to retake Stalingrad by getting a 3 round combat turn (haven't seen more than 2 myself, since Saturn). I took it back on an AV and reinforced. He'll need at least 2 combat rounds to retake it from one hex. By the way I had another infantry div EVAP on me last turn, the one guarding Stalingrad! Remember, in the Kessel, rules change, so break down those infantry divs and use them on defense ONLY. At least that is my experience.
I now hold Vorosh with some authority.
The Kettle is still hotly contested by 57 PzK and Sixth Army. But 1st Gds Cav Corps is starting to arrive. They were diverted from the north 4 turns ago to provide reinforcement. I am also getting a steady stream of reconstituted units moving on 2 or 3 at a time. I think I can keep him from breaking thru here. And when 1st Cav is ready they are going to go for Gumrak and take out his supply point. Then we'll see how bad Bruce wants to stay in the frying pan... How do I permanently destroy the supply point if I can't permanently occupy the hex?
Huge breakthrough toward the south from Valiknikov directly toward Marinskysys, which could cut off Sixth Army and friends from Rostov, if he doesn't divert some major units to try and stop.
On the west edge, his PzD(19th)is not moving on with too many units, and I am starting to wonder if he actually has a supply point there. IF NOT....his units could be destined to simply die there. Anybody know?
I am now pushing hard for hex (0, 30) to try and wipe out the supply point there.
Question, once an enemy supply point is overrun is it wiped out permanently? Do you have to occupy it for one turn, or more?
I'm starting to feel like Bruce has either put way too much confindence in 1st PzA, make a major strategic error in judgement, or underestimated me... :hurt:
Or, I am about to get a rude awakening!!! :whist:
Anyway, very intense game, great scenario, etc.!
Oh ya, and now that 1st PzA has shown up, now long until I get 44th Army? 28th Army would love to know!!! :skull:
Panzerpelle
19 Jul 04, 04:25
You can´t destroy supply points by capturing them. The only way they can disapear by is if the designer have programed the Evil ed to withdraw them. In Wintergewitter there are three such events: The supply point at Zimovinki and the the supply point at Gumrak(The one with a distant hex around it). And the supply point at Pitomnik it OP Thynderclap is activated (deploying and withdrawing of a supply point).
Just got off T17 to Bruce. Much remains the same from T16.
More panzer troops are heading north out of Rostov to try and stem the tide of Russian Guards armies moving south. I am also getting hit by the PzD on the west edge of the board, which is now coming on in full force. :-(
The Kessel continues to be hotly contested, with Bruce continuing to try and retake Stalingrad. I held him off this turn, maybe he will finally give up...
So, 1st PzA is moving out of Rostov, but still no sign of my 44th Army. Anybody know when it will be showing up? The reinforcement schedule shows no sign of it. Must be event triggered, I guess...
I've also noticed since the beginning of the game, that the Soviet air force is ALWAYS reorganizing except for 1 or 2 units. My airbases are not being attacked, so what gives?
Otherwise, I am feeling like I'm holding the edge here. Our casualties are tied at 17 each, so I think that's pretty good for the Soviets. :devious:
The game sits at a draw, with a total of 26 victory points for the Soviets.
Bdr.Mallette
09 Aug 04, 18:55
what combat setting do you have them on?
I find minimize losses helps units reorganize faster and allows for more ops for air.
Are you winning the air battle at the end of each round? or turn?
CyberRanger
16 Aug 04, 16:32
News Flash ---- Bruce has surrendered! :D
laszlo.nemedi
17 Aug 04, 06:32
News Flash ---- Bruce has surrendered! :D
Gip, gip gurrah (Russian style of Hiphiphurray)
:clap: :coolban: :clap:
When Bruce first informed me he was resigning I was actually kinda shocked and bummed out. All those hours of playtime and hard strategic thinking, and he quit before I even got the joy of surrounding and destroying him! :argh:
Actually I think he saw the big picture in "real-time" and saw how it was going to play out. I kept thinking he had reserves I couldn't see, or major reinforcements on the way, but apparently not. And with me scouting toward Rostov out of the WEST, and most of his supply hexes overrun, I guess I should have realized I had him.
It was a good fight! Bruce forced me to improve both my offense and defense, in order to withstand his attacks. Looks like it paid off. By not defending his left flank, and using all of 57PzK to hold on to (and even try to expand out of) the Kessel, I think he sealed his strategic doom.
Score one for the Ruskies!!! :joy:
My .SAV file below is the final Soviet move.
Game ON, boyz!
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