laszlo.nemedi against Francis Nash [Archive]

laszlo.nemedi

16 Mar 04, 00:18

his answer for my weather wuestion:

As far as the TOs: How about playing as the designer notes indicate, that
is no more than three selected one of which has to be a deployment of in
your case 2 Guards Army and in mine 57 PzK? Or do you have another
suggestion?

laszlo.nemedi

16 Mar 04, 07:57

Reading my posts here :D I will let him go with that many TOs

laszlo.nemedi

19 Mar 04, 12:48

I finished my turn 1 :D (TO selection):

TO south deployment selected (I don't want to see any surprise there...

TO Don reinforcement release (I hope he starts a relief effort)

TO Little Saturn will be selected on turn 5 (or somewhat)

CyberRanger

19 Mar 04, 13:02

Good Luck!

laszlo.nemedi

19 Mar 04, 16:59

I have got the turn 2 from him, as I see he chose an attack on the south (using brandenburger to help on the back, I am really lucky choosing the south depl).

Deeper analyse after I make my turn...

(I think if you choose 3 TOs when better to choose southern depl.)

laszlo.nemedi

19 Mar 04, 18:21

I will delete the attachment turn by turn, but here my turn.

Things almost right, no need for panic, actually I start to reduce the pocket, attacked the Italians, and dug in heavily...
(His shock bonus caused me heavy losses but I try to keep the momentum.)

Heinz57

20 Mar 04, 19:58

laszlo.nemedi

20 Mar 04, 23:58

Interesting -- looks like he did manage to get through to some elements of 2nd Gds, but no further. Good thing this wasn't MikeJ though, I see what you're saying there definitely.

Looks like he's gone with 19th PzD + Thunderclap...and trying to get some use of Thunderclap's components before they're withdrawn.

Watch overstacking around the pocket. Overall looks pretty good -- and he's given you Don Front...marvelous... :D

I don't know the rule of the ***** border, does he have to cross it or enough to step on the *****?

Red stacking: thanks, I didnot pay attention for it because I will use power against the pocket, so I need power up front...

Heinz57

21 Mar 04, 01:45

Not positive -- I know Pelle answered, but couldn't find the answer (will continue looking). Anyone else?

GunnerC

21 Mar 04, 03:07

Interesting. I'm in a similar situation on losses - this is 9-1 after 2, mine is about 12-4 after 4 (if I remember correctly). My game is far more fluid and open at the moment thoguh - due to his breakthroughs. If I can survive for the medium term then it may work in my advantage - though your bonus here is having the Don front available to you.

As Heinz says, be careful of overstacking. Once he works out how to use his artillery in an offensive manner it will really hurt you.

Southern Dandy

21 Mar 04, 17:18

Not positive -- I know Pelle answered, but couldn't find the answer (will continue looking). Anyone else?

Brent probably has the answer for certain, but I am about 90% certain that just being in a "*" hex isn't enough....an actual penetration of that border is necessary.

Anyone else want to guess too? :D

John

CyberRanger

21 Mar 04, 21:03

:nuts: As English isnt my native language...and seeing what I have written I find the word penetrate a bit funny....The intent is the link up from outside to inside...AG DON entering a hex /w "*"....Not 6th A. Actual link up between 6th A and relife forces is not what I mean. The units of DON front would not be inactive if the German relife attempt reached the boundaries of the Pocket.

If some wants to help me to formulate it in good clear english...

So ... non-6th Army units entering * hex.

laszlo.nemedi

22 Mar 04, 18:07

He could estabilished a thin line to pocket, and crossed the *** border so I can freely deploy my Don front.

I started a bigger counter attack, almost everywhere with success, so the tide is changing now. I hope he lost the selfconfidence and start to retreat...

(sav file later...)

Panzerpelle

23 Mar 04, 03:27

Not positive -- I know Pelle answered, but couldn't find the answer (will continue looking). Anyone else?
just entering a hex will suffice..if its AG DON.

laszlo.nemedi

23 Mar 04, 16:20

I have just finished turn 4 (next turn will be little saturn).

-in turn 3 he established a corridor to the pocket, and started to pull out what he can, but I am continously harrash him, so not much he could do
-in this turn I successfully killed Paulus HQ, and one more HQ unit.
-sent a unit into the corridor to block his escape
-in the meantime I attack north, south and a little bit in the central
-I prepared an attack on the central from the south

So many interesting thing here (but I think I am on attack now, and I don't want to change it...

plutonico

25 Mar 04, 10:20

why you dont attack with 28th army?
congratulations for kill the killer Paulus. But i dont like your 2nd Guards in South (why they are in red color?)

Panzerpelle

25 Mar 04, 12:25

I don't know the rule of the ***** border, does he have to cross it or enough to step on the *****?

Red stacking: thanks, I didnot pay attention for it because I will use power against the pocket, so I need power up front...
If a units of AG DON enters a hex with a "*" the DON Front is released...

laszlo.nemedi

26 Mar 04, 10:33

ayayayay

laszlo.nemedi

26 Mar 04, 10:35

Turn 5 is over. I am too tired to attach the save file (I will do it later).
Because my little saturn has started it gave me at least 6 tac rounds, so about 2 hours of fight on my side.
I made progress almost in every front, puched holes, and my bad behavior I send one unit into his center bulge to see what's happening there.
Almost closed the corridor (one hex remained, he will reopen it but his forces weak there, too.

Advance in the north and the south, in the previous turn I show desire to attack in the center, and in the replay I saw he sent reserves there, so my attack on the north and the south will push him to send the same reinforcement to there (I like seeing reserves moving to and back)...

plutonico

26 Mar 04, 10:50

the file because some of us are waiting our games and while we learn of the masters
:)

laszlo.nemedi

26 Mar 04, 10:53

the file because some of us are waiting our games and while we learn of the masters
:)

I will go home and will attach the file.

The Master, who was defeated by MikeJ twice :nuts:

laszlo.nemedi

26 Mar 04, 13:03

so here is...

GunnerC

26 Mar 04, 13:47

Looks pretty good to me ! Keep working on the North front and the weak Rumanians inthe South and you'll be in danger of a mass encirclement of his entire army !

I think he's made a mistake committing so much to a pocket break-out. He can't hope to keep the location VP's, so at most he'll save a few points by extracting a few HQ's. n exchange you get the entire Don front rolling West. :D :D :D

laszlo.nemedi

26 Mar 04, 17:17

Turn 6 end:

Highest shock, so 2 hours of fight...

South and north very good, I could force his units to retreat many times.

I started the second encirclement in the center.

I could seal the kessel, only one HQ could escape, but I am in touch with it.

Kessel/pocket is getting destroyed, few (5-6) turns and over...

So I am satisfied :D

laszlo.nemedi

27 Mar 04, 05:24

turn 7, 2 hours of fight again, need some sleep...

GunnerC

27 Mar 04, 06:21

Looks cool !

Should see great advances in the very South in the next turn or two, and it doesn't seem like he'll be able to rescue his pocket in time. :D

laszlo.nemedi

27 Mar 04, 08:49

Looks cool !

Should see great advances in the very South in the next turn or two, and it doesn't seem like he'll be able to rescue his pocket in time. :D
Actually I pushed him away from the pocket, so the tendency is good, now I can go forward to encircle him...

Thanks...

laszlo.nemedi

28 Mar 04, 08:03

turn 8

a big hole in the north, and in the south of his defense, I pushed his forces in many places back, so I could keep up the speed without shock, too

(at least 6 tac rounds 60-70% of the attacks was ignore losses...)

laszlo.nemedi

30 Mar 04, 15:09

turn 9

gain some area, could destroy some encircled units on the north,
but a mistake (useage of supply drain and early turn end).
I hope he won't recognose it...

laszlo.nemedi

30 Mar 04, 15:10

and the attachment

plutonico

31 Mar 04, 08:10

he have a big caos in the north. have you divided some units? and it seems that he has not any probability to link the kessel.

laszlo.nemedi

31 Mar 04, 08:18

he have a big caos in the north. have you divided some units? and it seems that he has not any probability to link the kessel.
Most of his units in the North is forced to divide so probable these units in reorg, or very weak.
Yes, I divided some units to make supply drain attack against some encircled enemy units.
It seems he still wants to link to the Kessel, but I can reclose it if needed...

Heinz57

31 Mar 04, 12:20

Your northern offensive looks really good, especially pocketing the HQ's!

Suggestions might consider pulling the Don Front units currently augmenting 5th TA/5th Shock to concentrate either on the left or right flank and apply the relieved forces in further support of an offensive in the direction of Verchne Solonov/Tormosin, or Morozovsk depending on interests.

Similarly, south of the pocket, consideration might be given to concentrating units together by colors to get better cooperation and reduce penalties with 2nd Gds.

The NW really looks good, ha...

laszlo.nemedi

04 Apr 04, 09:33

Turn 12

south pushing forward (not much left for him)
north nice pushing forward, I can move forward anytime

center: pocket secured, he start to retreat, so I have to push harder on the envelop

I started the air war (until that I rested my air forces) on turn 11, some success but still need attacking

Southern Dandy

04 Apr 04, 14:02

Laszlo--

Looks like you're doing great in your game! Millerovo should be yours in a turn or two...

He's going to have some tough choices to make regarding the units of 1st PzA when it begins arriving. Wherever he chooses to employ those divisions, it'll likely stop your advance in that area, but there's so many places he's in bad shape, based on what I saw in the .SAL, that you should be able to keep the pressure on him.

Good luck and keep up the fine work, tovarich!

John

laszlo.nemedi

04 Apr 04, 14:09

Thanks, I feel self-confident too.

(being good was a bad thing too in Stalin era, so I start to make mistakes :nuts:

laszlo.nemedi

05 Apr 04, 17:07

turn 13

good

Heinz57

05 Apr 04, 22:11

Looking very good Laszlo! In particular, between last turn and this turn, it looks like you've maneuvered your 1st and 2nd Gds Armies into positions of better cooperation.

My opponent is on hiatus for at least a week -- still on T6, What Axis units are offering you the most resistance, and what Soviet formations seem to be the least/best reliable (i.e., in terms of going into reorg, etc.)?

laszlo.nemedi

12 Apr 04, 09:42

Turn 16

Millerovo secured, I started to encircle his far north troops, and his remaining north troops.
In the center he could manage to withdraw units in a very good style, so Francis very good in defense.
His forces around Voroshilovgrad, I think he will build a defense line on the Donetz river.
On the south he built up a defense line so my aim is now to capture as much units as I can around Kotelnikovo.
The pocket is still hold but slowly but surely collapse...

Heinz57

12 Apr 04, 22:35

Now that looks really good. It took a minute to see the "whole picture" - following the waves...on half of "the front" he does not have a front line, but a bunch of mostly unconnected line segments. That probably does not bode very well for the other half. The pocket looks good too. Good job!

plutonico

13 Apr 04, 09:15

his north is broken and theatren are numerous.german are moving some units by train ¿what are?

someone knows how we go, more game wining-lossing-drawing?
plutonico

Southern Dandy

13 Apr 04, 11:44

Laszlo, that .SAL was beautiful to see! The Axis is on the run in your game, whether he realizes or not!

I'm guessing that's 3rd PzD along the south bank of the Donetz between Belaya Kalitva and Krasnodar...

I'm sure you know this, but I'll emphasize it for your planning...all of the water on the map, except for the Sea of Azov, is frozen over. Bridges are no longer neccessary for your advance (supply, yes, but that's not the issue now!), so if he wants to defend them, you can easily bypass and encircle him.

I nominate Tovarich Nemedi for the Order of Lenin and the Hero of the Soviet Union awards. Really wonderful work!

Ivan

laszlo.nemedi

17 Apr 04, 04:24

I had to strengthen the south sector.
In the far north I will crack his forces (I started to envelop them).
In the north everything is OK, and I start to envelop them, too.

In the center I am struggling, and he continously withdraw his units, which is bad...

In the south now everuthing is OK now...

laszlo.nemedi

18 Apr 04, 02:34

Turn 18
in the North I getting loose the concentration, so I have to define goal there.

in the center I just defend, so he could pull out forces, but he has strong defense there.

in the south I attacked...

the kessel is tarting to collapse now, but he is good at defense...

laszlo.nemedi

19 Apr 04, 16:44

One bigger encircle in the middle north, it will be destroyed soon

one encircle in the south it will be destroyed soon, too

race for his supply points in the north

kessel is OK

defense in the center as he made some counter-attack, I would like to show some weakness here to let him think a local victory here, but it will help me in a bigger encirclement here...

laszlo.nemedi

03 May 04, 14:06

Sorry, but didnot have time to post here, but I did the turns regulary with Francis.

The situation generally: Francis lost ground turn by turn and he has no chance to gain the initiative back, but he made a fantastic effort in the defense and avoided all my encirclement efforts.

So I am at turn 31
My primary goals are to capture as many victory point as I can, but I have some bad feeling as not much turn left.
It seems Operation Koltso was not a big shock for me and Francis, so it did not help.

I hope I can capture the victory points but it will be just in time then...

plutonico

04 May 04, 08:47

and kessel and Zithomir can be captured in nine turns, but i dont know if is enough to victory. However after seeing your turn 19 and this, the stop of the north front it looks a miracle¡¡

CyberRanger

04 May 04, 09:45

and kessel and Zithomir can be captured in nine turns, but i dont know if is enough to victory. However after seeing your turn 19 and this, the stop of the north front it looks a miracle¡¡
add to that Lisichansk (in the west) and 5 pts for Kotelnikovo. Around Voroshilovgrad, if you can get all the artiller possible and pound him relentless for 9 turns, you may take it.

The moral of the story .... as the Soviet player, we must take a big 30 point vp spot for victory. But darn those German units get hard to budge!

laszlo.nemedi

04 May 04, 10:10

One remark, as I chose the south deployment, it caused a weak north front. After the breakthrough in the north I just don't have enough power to control everything so (just like Montgomery) I chose the safe going forward, which helped Francis to save some forces. I attacked blindly and not concentrate on the victory location, I should have gained them first and not care with the possible danger, but I was not sure if he has some forces on my sides to make big trouble.
His defense is behind the river which really not help me to make a breakthrough again, so I have to rethink everything and concentrate on the victory points, but it will make me predictable...

plutonico

04 May 04, 10:17

very slow because of that i think is best to lost some units in the front that stop the avance. fight and fight comrade¡¡
plutonico

plutonico

04 May 04, 10:19

only four or five person are seeing this forum)

:crosseye:

Tiberius

04 May 04, 20:11

We're here! And very thankful for the leadership of guys like you and Laszlo.

laszlo.nemedi

07 May 04, 07:12

t35:

Gumrak at last is mine.
fighting for the victory locations

BE CAREFUL:

if his Brandenburgers still can fly in the last turn, he can drop them on victory location, so I started to send troops to the occupied victory location just in case...

laszlo.nemedi

08 May 04, 05:31

t36

I think I can change it to marginal victory in few turns, with big luck I can capture Rostov, but no much possibility.

Our game is now back and forward game, he does active defense, the question how long he can manage with his small units. My units are exhausted but still stronger than his...

Southern Dandy

08 May 04, 08:24

Peeked at your turn 35 .SAL late last night...

Re: Brandenbergers- in the .SAL I looked at, 2/3 of them are located, and you're closer to the nearest airfields than one of them. Did you destroy the other 1/3 in combat already? While it's certainly a good idea to garrison VP locations to prevent late turn silliness, it may be less an issue than you think.

I'm not sure what you have for reinforcements to arrive near the kessel yet....but I'd urge you to reduce it ASAP. He's getting one bonus point a turn just for holding Stalingrad (Pelle, correct me if I'm wrong)...plus, it's a VP location, and I counted 3 Korps HQs still in the kessel. That, with Voroshilograd, may be enough...

More analysis later, probably....I hope my turn 35 situation looks as good!

John

Panzerpelle

08 May 04, 10:09

I'm not sure what you have for reinforcements to arrive near the kessel yet....but I'd urge you to reduce it ASAP. He's getting one bonus point a turn just for holding Stalingrad (Pelle, correct me if I'm wrong)...plus, it's a VP location, and I counted 3 Korps HQs still in the kessel. That, with Voroshilograd, may be enough...
!

John
You are correct! There are approx. 5VP (stalingrad), 5VPs?(1 per turn for the remaining turns, but the game can go on for a couple of turns after turn 40)for holding stalingrad, 3 corps HQ at 1 VP..could be approx. 13 VPs in total...and the loss penalty maybe 1 or 2 more...

laszlo.nemedi

08 May 04, 13:12

laszlo.nemedi

08 May 04, 13:13

You are correct! There are approx. 5VP (stalingrad), 5VPs?(1 per turn for the remaining turns, but the game can go on for a couple of turns after turn 40)for holding stalingrad, 3 corps HQ at 1 VP..could be approx. 13 VPs in total...and the loss penalty maybe 1 or 2 more...
Is it mean the Stalingrad VP only or there is a radius where the Germans can be?

Panzerpelle

09 May 04, 03:59

Is it mean the Stalingrad VP only or there is a radius where the Germans can be?
stalingrad hex is the trigger for the cancel event of the VP loop...

laszlo.nemedi

09 May 04, 05:58

Pelle, thanks! (it is much better for me, however you would change it to the other way, and the kessel would be the aim, not Stalingrad.

My game:

turn 37:
I could change now to marginal victory (he will recapture some victory point but now I can recapture it everytime.

laszlo.nemedi

11 May 04, 11:08

Just getting more and more exciting.
One mistake either side and it could mean a defeat of one side.
I have some minor advantage, but easily can loose it. I expend more and more time for planning, but it is very simple now, all my turns concentrate on the victory locations...

laszlo.nemedi

16 May 04, 04:55

End of turn 41 (I hope this is the end of the scenario, but I made some test and in that the scenario ended at turn 42):

Now it is marginal victory for me.

In the last two turns he got a new division and that division changed the battle (fresh units with big numbers), and the situation changed always from marginal defeat to marginal victory. I had an early turn end in turn 40, so it was very dangerous, but I managed in this (last turn) the marginal victory again.
I am not far from Morozovsk and Rostov (2 hexes without defeding units), so if one more turn will be happening than I can capture Rostov, but I am not sure if I can hold Vorosilovgrad.

Essence: Go for Vorosilivgrad doesnot matter how much you have to pay for it, because not much time for that. The opponents surely will build up a defense line at the river with gresh units (your units will be depleted in that time), so be Rommel, I was Monty :(

So let see if it is the end or not...

laszlo.nemedi

18 May 04, 04:22

Turn 43, and still not the end :nuts:

If I could figure it out before I would have plan attack according that... In these turns both side concentrate only on the victory locations, so the fight is not funny, and we are the hand of the big TOAW probability.
Actually Marginal Victory for me, but it can change easily to Draw too...

My opponent got fresh units, and these units are lethal in this overtime fight...

plutonico

18 May 04, 04:29

and conquer berlin¡¡

CyberRanger

18 May 04, 08:13

Turn 43, and still not the end :nuts:
...
Great battle! Good information to know the scenario may run that long.

laszlo.nemedi

18 May 04, 08:40

and my save file

laszlo.nemedi

20 May 04, 05:11

Game ended at turn 44, I got Marginal Victory, victory level: 36

The end result was achieved by success (from draw). I was successful to push out a 11 strength unit from Vorosilovgrad, which changed the situation (I needed concentrate only this battle only to win it...).

My style in the beginning was very agressive, but as the situation progressed I changed as Francis punished every mistake I made, that's why I tried to reduce the mistakes which made me a Montgomery style cautious general. (and I was a little bit too much self-confident :o )

This scenario asks the Soviet general to be very agressive as the victory points are far and can be well defended.
I got the 44th army very late, so they could not put much in the situation, but I don't know what would be the situation in early arrive...