CMBB Op Level Game [Archive] - GameSquad Forums

Pvt Reese

13 Oct 05, 16:20

Hi chaps

check out the BFC forums (newly re-arranged) for news of a very interesting 'addition' for CMBB :)

Cheers
:cheeky:

Tripps

13 Oct 05, 17:24

How about you post this twice, and not give the link? :cheeky:

That way I can do it :)

http://www.battlefront.com/products/cmc/index.html

Pvt Reese

13 Oct 05, 17:30

Hi Tripps

I like to make people work for it :-)

Tripps

13 Oct 05, 17:38

You made me work for it...

I should should now charge anyone who clicks my link... :p

Palantir

13 Oct 05, 18:06

Well thats good news for CM players.

This is almost exactly like what one of the KG guys has been doing for a few years in his own "CM Campaign."

Now we can finally link together (move) a large formation and fight it out on the tactical map. Plus it has the much desired PBEM feature.

At least BFC will make some money off it's WW2 fans now. And at $35 it will be affordable.
Strange how some of the posts (even admins) act as if BFC pulled one over on the CM (WW2) players. I just don't understand such logic.

Only question is it's release date.

GJK

13 Oct 05, 18:31

Should I even mention about "that guy" in the other thread that said that "this guy" even wanted BFC to lie to him about the status of CMx2? No, no, no, I shouldn't - but I just did..... :devil:

ER_Chaser

13 Oct 05, 18:58

THis is definitely cool stuff, I would definitely go for it, whatever they charge :)

This will be fun even playing against AI, let alone organized against ppls! :banana:

KG_Cloghaun

13 Oct 05, 19:24

Holy ****!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :cheeky: :cheeky: :eek: :eek: :love:

British Tommy

13 Oct 05, 19:36

Should I even mention about "that guy" in the other thread that said that "this guy" even wanted BFC to lie to him about the status of CMx2? No, no, no, I shouldn't - but I just did..... :devil:

Naughty GJK! :laugh:
:devil:

British Tommy

13 Oct 05, 19:40

Will be following this with great interest! :)
Sounds like a wonderful way to play operations and it will extend the life of CMBB :smoke:
Think they got a winner here! :joy: :banana:

Palantir

13 Oct 05, 21:01

Sounds like a wonderful way to play operations and it will extend the life of CMBB. Think they got a winner here!
Makes you wonder about the viability of "CMx2 WW2" coming out ANY time soon when they pump up an "old" game of CMx1 to such a high degree. A very good degree too.

But I want all of you to remember something- BFC does not really care about your opinions on this nor do they care if you buy it (those of you who PBEM and wanted something WW2). You are of no consequence in their planning if I remember all those CMx2 comments. :skull:

Just read some of the posts on this by their admin, no I mean really read them. Because if you do and can put it all together you will be quite surprised at what they think of you... :kotz:

I don't understand the mentality of BFC "officials" to blast the very customers they want to buy their stuff, and feed their kids. :crosseye:

ER_Chaser

13 Oct 05, 21:35

wow... boss, you are seriously against those folks now :D ....

Well, I do not really care that much, people do stupid things, right? :)

KG_Jag

13 Oct 05, 21:49

At KG we're having trouble getting our Campaign Master, KG_Thorshammer, off the ceiling! He and our fearless leader Frank are having a contest to see who can bounce off more walls in celebration of this announcement.

But they both will have to bounce to where they have stashed $35 (slightly more for Dave because he has only Canadian money) and then keep bouncing "until it's ready."

At KG we can hold out until the release date by continuing play with one or more of the campaigns that Dave has already designed or has in the works.

KG_Jag

13 Oct 05, 21:52

By the way this is not a Battlefront product. I wonder if this announcement was moved up in an effort to mend some fences with those of us comprising the "minority segment of the customer base."

Regardless, it's good news and does not involve either Syria or an imaginary modern brush war.

P.S. Tripps I'm not paying you for your link. I got mine from KG_Thorshammer!

The Purist

13 Oct 05, 22:38

Well thats good news for CM players.

This is almost exactly like what one of the KG guys has been doing for a few years in his own "CM Campaign."

This sort of campaign is what I was talking about in that other thread,...but my idea was for one set in North Africa. Ah, well, I'll have to put it off for a year or two until people get tired of never ending Panther and Tiger fights at Kursk. :cheeky:

Edit: So, um,...when are they going to put out a version for AK/Western Front?

Full Monty

13 Oct 05, 23:18

This sort of campaign is what I was talking about in that other thread,...but my idea was for one set in North Africa. Ah, well, I'll have to put it off for a year or two until people get tired of never ending Panther and Tiger fights at Kursk. :cheeky:

Edit: So, um,...when are they going to put out a version for AK/Western Front?

A North Africa campaign would be great! But I'm guessing that the 'Clash of the Evil Empires' rakes in more $$$$ than the Mediterranean 'sideshow' :rolleyes:

KGPanzerschrecK

13 Oct 05, 23:34

My guess is the boys over at BFC had to do some major damage control and had to release the info on "Combat Mission Campaigns" more than a little bit early when the early reviews on CMSF were'nt exactly recieved with open arms, except by the members of the "Brown Nose Brigade" over at BFC's forum.

But hey, what do i know, im one of the uninitiated few who waste my time playing other people in PBEM/TCI-IP games instead of being a member of the true customer base who take on the daunting challenge of playing that juggernaut of a strategest, the "PC".

Tripps

13 Oct 05, 23:40

KGPanzerschrecK

13 Oct 05, 23:49

HAHAHA that post gave me a good chuckle to finish Friday afternoon :) :laugh:

I aim to please. :nuts:

Palantir

14 Oct 05, 00:18

wow... boss, you are seriously against those folks now

No, I'm not against anyone & probably not with the designers (whoever they are have given the CM'ers a nice present) but with the "BFC admins" who think they are cute by backhandedly insulting the very people who will be paying their bills this winter. Now, how many of those bills they will be able to pay depends on how many players buy their product doesn't it? :devious:

I found the one comment that they (admins) were laughing & drinking at how stupid we, that forum CM WW2 PBEM crowd, would look when the Op LvL game came out very peculiar. Not that I follow the weird logic of why we'd look stupid over something we would want, (CMx1, Op Level, PBEM capable). But the fact they think we're stupid for wanting to play the very game they designed... :nuts:

I have doubts about the quality of management at BFC based on their website and how they relate to their customers.

I also think the BIG lack of interest for a modern CM prompted the quick release about CM Op Lvl. Otherwise it's a marketing snafu, because it just turns off CMx2's spotlight. Now why would anyone want to sweep such a wonderous product like CMx2 out of the glare of the public's eye so fast?

Oh well, it's too bad the folks at BFC never polled the players about it or read forums other than their own.

:hmmm: I wonder should I: they did ask for designers to contact them about CM Op Lvl... :whist:

KGPanzerschrecK

14 Oct 05, 01:31

I havent heard it put any better than that Kerry. I couldnt agree with you more. The release of the information on CMC was definately done to placate those who were not happy with CMSF. Anyone who belives otherwise is simply fooling themselves. Just my .02 cents.

Patrocles

14 Oct 05, 11:54

How about you post this twice, and not give the link? :cheeky:

That way I can do it :)

http://www.battlefront.com/products/cmc/index.html

thanks for the link!
sounds interesting! I just heard about this today....hehe
:)

Tripps

14 Oct 05, 20:10

Did you click it? Did ya did ya huh huh?
That'll be.... lets see, no tax cos your overseas.....but exchange rate does come into it....NZ dollar kinda strong at the mo....no patents on hyperlinks i see...no ads on the link, thats gotta count for something these days.....add 4, carry the 2, ok - you owe me a "thanks" - oh, i see you've already said that - so we'll call it square ok? But dont come back saying you gotta bad deal or i robbed you or anything ok?

Tripps

14 Oct 05, 20:13

I found the one comment that they (admins) were laughing & drinking at how stupid we
They did?
They just got added to my 'people I hope to meet one day so we can have a nice chat' list.....

So far its filled with Virii/Spyware/Malware/browserHijack writers and supporters, not a good list to be on methinks :)

Palantir

14 Oct 05, 23:14

You just have to read their own threads and the posts, assuming they haven't "disappeared...".

ER_Chaser

15 Oct 05, 10:15

Jim has a review on this as well :) hhah...

The Purist

15 Oct 05, 11:30

The beauty of this operational system is that it will allow us to fight battles based on what's happening 'out there' rather than the never ending quick battles. Unlike scenarios, where there are no consequences to 'a near run thing', being aware that your extreme losses may cost you the next battle will effect tactics. This is a good thing.

My biggest complaint with the QBs is that there is never a reference to anything historical. Just pick the best force you can and hope the other guy didn't pick the OoB that can defeat yours. More over, there is no intelligence on what is out there (very unrealistic), now, with an operational map and units you can move assets where needed and the "super-OoB" are things of the past.

Teams will have to be careful, however, in not putting unrealistic operational units into the battles. There would be little point in putting a panzer division on the map totally equipped with Panthers, or a Guards tank Corps with nothing but IS-2m. Here we will actually have a tool that will (hopefully) let us recreate the actual battles that occurred in Russia during the war in the east.

With this potential, the only thing for this forum to do is to decide on the size of the campaign we wish to recreate. We may have the ability to try out "Barbarossa" between June 41 - Mar 42, "Stalingrad" - July 42 to Feb 43, or even the entire war in the east. The problems would be one of scale. While it would be impossible to recreate any of the above at a scale of 1:1, that is, one division actually avalable being represented in the game, butuse of "Elements of" would probably work extremely well.

In my mind, "Elements of" is providing a representative ratio for units from a historical OoB. The choice can be made to represent a division or a corps with a lower eschelon unit with some "dressing". For example, if one were to attempt a corps level recreation of the entire Barbarossa operation, an infantry corps may be represented by an infantry reg't drawn from the historical OoBs in the game. In this case, our "corps" might have:

3 infantry battalions
6 75mm infantry guns
2 150mm infantry guns
4 37mm AT guns
3 81mm Mortar observer

The above matches (to a fairly accurate degree) the actual OoB of a German infantry regiment circa 1941. Since we are trying to represent a corps (without any significant armour support) we could add:

1 assault gun battery (6 vehicles)
1 or two batteries of 105mm artillery
an engineer or pioneer "unit" (company or a pair of platoons)

Other "attached" units could be added from a pool of units held at army or army group level. Where two corps or more are present, there could be added the heavier 150mm+ observer(s) representing the heavy batteries.

The benifit of "Element of" campaigns is that you can represent larger scale action in a managable format and thus capture the "feel" of the entire campaign. This might require the inserrtion of a strategic level map showing the placement of the corps units for all to see (posted in a sticky for monthly turns, for example) while the operational game is handle by CMC and the actual combat by CMBB.

I have more but figure this is plenty to chew on for now.

Palantir

15 Oct 05, 11:57

The Purist

15 Oct 05, 12:13

Actually if you can get a tournament going with several "teams" per side per division (with several divisions) you could recreate a good sized battle and then just continue the action from there.

Put all that action together and you'll have a complete picture of a stategic operation.

Yes, but not the operational or strategic context. The Russian front is so large and complex that any divisional scale action at 1:1 scale would leave out far too much of what is going on "over the next hill". "Elements of" allows the same teams (AGN, AGC, AGS, for example) to control the entire front (or significant part of it) and the success or failure of the operations.

Palantir

15 Oct 05, 16:33

:blab: :blab:

Yes, but you can at least go from a "simple" tac battle of Btn's & enlarge it to Divisional scale or more.

Besides think of it this way-

Round A- Operation begins with Axis Div #1 vs Allied Div #1 (maybe taking several rounds to complete- whatever it takes to determine the "outcome."

Round B- we move "over the hill" to the north and have Div #2 vs Div #2.
Round C we go south and have Div #3 vs Div #3...

Obviously you're not going to recreate the whole operation (what ever it is) nor a whole front, but you can have a great "feel" of how it would unfold on a good sized battle.

I think that would be nice deal wouldn't you?

The Purist

15 Oct 05, 16:43

Yes, but you can at least go from a "simple" tac battle of Btn's & enlarge it to Divisional scale or more. Besides think of it this way- ....

:laugh: No, no, no, Palantir,...your thinking tournament. I'm thinking "campaign game", with two teams ,1 axis, 1 soviet, and a pair or trio of "moderators"(who don't play unless as stand ins) to oversee the administaration of turns and who makes contact with whom. Your not trying for "balanced" games but re-creations of the battles in a campaign (of whatever scale). Players do not have to command specific units but would rather form a pool of commanders who could be assigned to battles by their respective high commands.

Obviously you're not going to recreate the whole operation (what ever it is) nor a whole front...

Sure you could,...you just have to pick the right scale :) :cheeky: Don't you think it would be fun to re-create the German drive from the Soviet frontier to Moscow?

Jim1954

18 Oct 05, 13:44

They said IF the version for CMBB sells, they would consider doing one for CMAK, since the majority of the work would have already been done. No timetable yet.

liuzg150181

22 Oct 05, 09:44

They said IF the version for CMBB sells, they would consider doing one for CMAK, since the majority of the work would have already been done. No timetable yet.
Well,maybe also for CM:BO?
Anyway waiting ernestly for its release.....

airBiscuit

20 Jan 06, 19:04

I thought I would necromantically resurrect this thread to highlight this very cool product. In review the link to CMC is:

http://www.battlefront.com/products/cmc/news.html

I'm thinking "campaign game", with two teams ,1 axis, 1 soviet, and a pair or trio of "moderators"(who don't play unless as stand ins) to oversee the administaration of turns and who makes contact with whom. Your not trying for "balanced" games but re-creations of the battles in a campaign (of whatever scale). Players do not have to command specific units but would rather form a pool of commanders who could be assigned to battles by their respective high commands.

I agree with the Purist's concept of running a campaign with multiple players, at least for assigning folks to tactical battles. The most important thing in the campaign is how the team does, not the level of success of any one commander.

There is nothing new reported from the site as to when it will be released, though I haven't read the forums yet.