WinSPMBT - Who can guess ?

[Achilles]

Gentlemen,

What do you think will be the major upgrade in the gameplay of WinSPMBT ?

Let's see who is inside the designers' head !!! :D

cheers

[Dano]

Swim suit models in tanks

[Double Deuce]

What do you think will be the major upgrade in the gameplay of WinSPMBT ?Tough question. What do we think or what would we like? :whist:

I think gameplay is already pretty solid. My hoped for "upgrades" would be primarily technical.



More PBem slots,
Definable deploy zones similar to what's in Combat Mission,
An updated Map Editor like Fred Chandla's has done for SPWAW,
Ability to dump the entre map to a bmp or jpg file.
That's all I can think of at the moment. I'm still working on my 1st cup of coffee. :D

[Achilles]

Come on DD,

I am speaking about "GAMEPLAY MECHANISM" !!! :D

Ohhhh.... It is too good to be true.... :smoke:

[Double Deuce]

Ohhhh.... It is too good to be true.... :smoke:How about designer created deploy zones like in Combat Mission!:D

OR

Online Play!

[junk2drive]

What I would like is less friendly fire from air assets.

[Boonierat]

Come on DD,

I am speaking about "GAMEPLAY MECHANISM" !!! :D

Ohhhh.... It is too good to be true.... :smoke:

They turned SPMBT into an RTS game? :p

[Double Deuce]

I am speaking about "GAMEPLAY MECHANISM" !!! :D Actually I've only played like 4-5 games in the history of SPMBT so I am not familair real with the "GamePlay" or supposed bugs and anomalies.I wouldn't even know what to ask for in the area of gameplay. My interest is in the designer capabilities. :whist:

[Warhero]

Hmm I would like to see possibility play WinMBT/WW2 online as in SPWAW :p... Wouldn't it cool eh? PBEM is too "slow" way for me (yes I have played several games that way with SP1-3 and MBT).

And maybe some "surprises" as new nations? For example Colombia, Venezuela, Mexico etc :p ...

These came into my mind at this moment.

[dita]

Hmmm, gameplay improvements.

Not sure exactly what you mean. Online play would be a major move. I may even be tempted to try that myself. Streamline the interface in some way perhaps? Make the gameplay smoother and more intuitive?

I`d agree with DD. Improvements on the editor, PBEM slots and "deployment zones" How about different victory hexes (points per turn, is that already implemented, I`m not sure?)

Also, I expect some additional OOB. I seen a poll recently in the yahoo group asking what nations would people like to see added. Though I don`t know if that was an "official" poll

[Double Deuce]

How about different victory hexes.. This is something I would like as well. SPMBT has the ability to change the points and remove them all as a whole BUT SPWAW has many good options here that really allow designers to be creative.

[Achilles]

Ok, maybe the problem is my bad english... :confused:

Guys... what are the worst gamey tactics or non-realistic elements of the SP games? :D :D :D

For example in SPWAW there is a bug with the unlimited direct fire of smoke ammo (X-shots)...of course this is not present at SPMBT, but anyway... what is your wish-list for more realistic gameplay?

[Double Deuce]

Ok, maybe the problem is my bad english... :confused:

Guys... what are the worst gamey tactics or non-realistic elements of the SP games? :D :D :D How about;

Running units up the side of the map,
Recon with trucks or units not really suited/designed for that role but being used as suicide squads.

[dita]

I think those are the two main factors that DD has mentioned. Recon by using loads of trucks etc is one of the major problems. Can`t see how it could be progammed in to avoid this issue though

[Double Deuce]

I think those are the two main factors that DD has mentioned. Recon by using loads of trucks etc is one of the major problems. Can`t see how it could be progammed in to avoid this issue thoughUness they built in a rarity setting like in SPWAW.....

[Skotty702]

Ok, maybe the problem is my bad english... :confused:

Guys... what are the worst gamey tactics or non-realistic elements of the SP games? :D :D :D

For example in SPWAW there is a bug with the unlimited direct fire of smoke ammo (X-shots)...of course this is not present at SPMBT, but anyway... what is your wish-list for more realistic gameplay?

1) Mech inf units that unload and fire all their allocated shots. Then reload back into the APC and unit load and gain an additional shot.

2) Z fire that drifts through several building hexes on a random basis. Or another way of stating this, Z key fires into areas blocked by LOS from the firing unit. I have seen MG fire drift several hexes into dense urban hexes.

3) Fix the damn right click enemy unit info screen that will tell
you how many crew remain in vehicles and crew weapons. This is total ******** to see this info. You damage a tank, you don't know what you did, but if you right click on the unit, you can see what crew remains. If there is 4 out of 5 remaining, the tank is still a threat, but if only one remains, it is pretty much harmless. This definatley need fixing!!! Bad for PBEM.

4) Bug, Helos get stuck in deep mine belts. I was assaulting Iraq as the US in 2003 and I had an Apache take one point of damage over an unspotted mine belt early in the battle. This was a PBEM
battle. The rest of the battle the Apache tried to flee but it just flew in very small circles. This continued till the end of the battle. When finished and I viewed the map, the helo was over the only 2 clear hexes in a 4 hex deep mine field. I have also seen WW2 FJ troops stay pinned the whole battle cuz there were mines in an adjacent hex. These units were in contact all the way up the the AO unit which was only 4 hexes away, including the plt HQ and coy HQ.

5) Fortifications that suck up OP fire. Fortifications will attempt to fire on spotted units that are out of the field of
fire and suck up TONS of OP fire from other units. Annoying in
single player games, but damn gamey in PBEM when you opponent
shuts off all the weapons and Z fires away. Or, when you move a unit forward out of the field of fire and the fort tries to fire on the advancing unit, supporting friendly OP fire will engage the fort and suck up shots and movement.

6)Bug, COIN strikes need tweaking. They have a bad tendancy to
attack friendly soft units. I can understand if you called a strike close to your units. However, I have had COIN strikes
attack my arty park eventhough my plot hex was on the other side of the map, 8k to 10k away or farther. The only way to avoid this is to buy only mech forces and leave your mech inf loaded in the APCs at the end of the turn.

7) Units getting fully restored movement points after being fired on and rallying to READY status, eventhough after the unit has moved several hexes.

8)Para mortar units that are classed "Airborne Field Howitzers" will OP fire at enemy units in your opponents turns. NO OTHER MORTARS DO THIS!

9) Soft vehicles only seem to blowup AFTER all the crew is destroyed when engaged by direct fire. Trucks can sometimes take
5 to 8 hits from inf and tank fire before it will blow. And if
just MG fire, it's worse. When soft vehicle has a crew of 8 to 10
it can take forever knock out. Sure it will route, but after getting hit by 4 50cal bursts and 5 75mm HE shots, it should more than dead.

That's all I can think of for now.

Pyros, PLEASE forward this the ivory castle that AG and DG live in cuz I have been posting several of these issues on the yahoo groups for over a year with NO responses.

Cheers
Scott

[Achilles]

Ahhh, what makes me sad is that I will have to re-work some of my TACTICS.... It will be so difficult to use **** Tactics...

Seriously, the big winner of this upgrade will be the realism of the applied tactics. Gamey tactics will suffer considerably. :smoke:

p.s DD, special care has been taken for the map issue. :D
p.s Ok, that's it for now... :hush:

[Achilles]

Hi Scotty (I hope your mother-in-law is fine as always :laugh: ),

Consider these notes sent to AG and DG in the next five minutes!!!

cheers,
Pyros

[dita]

ahhh, now those are "gamey" issues :)

Either I`m naive or I`ve just been lucky. I didn`t realise about some of those items and/or ever remember been a victim of them :)

Like I said, I`m probably a bit naive :)

[Skotty702]

Hi Scotty (I hope your mother-in-law is fine as always :laugh: ),

Consider these notes sent to AG and DG in the next five minutes!!!

cheers,
Pyros

Everybody is fine but me. I have some weird fever/chills thing that is probally virus since I have had to runs of different antibotics and had no effect. Make matters worse, the second antibotice caused an allergic reaction and caused a very nasty rash. :(

Enough doom and gloom. :) Thank you greatly for passing on the info to AG and DG. I am not taking out my butt here, since I have pretty played SPCAMO stuff since 2003 and have over 300 PBEM posted over at the blitz. Of which, only about 20 are non SPCAMO battles.

Cheers
Scott

[Achilles]

No Paul,

You are a great guy !!! :)

Btw, what is going on with my nation???

First the Euro cup in football, yesterday the Eurovision song contest? This is not normal... :nuts:

cheers,
Pyros

[Achilles]

Everybody is fine but me. I have some weird fever/chills thing that is probally virus since I have had to runs of different antibotics and had no effect. Make matters worse, the second antibotice caused an allergic reaction and caused a very nasty rash. :(

Enough doom and gloom. :) Thank you greatly for passing on the info to AG and DG. I am not taking out my butt here, since I have pretty played SPCAMO stuff since 2003 and have over 300 PBEM posted over at the blitz. Of which, only about 20 are non SPCAMO battles.

Cheers
Scott

Scott,

you are the first thing (I mean person) that comes into my mind when I hear the word "SPMBT"... :laugh:

take care and have a quick recovery,
Pyros

[Double Deuce]

Enough doom and gloom. :) Thank you greatly for passing on the info to AG and DG. I am not taking out my butt here, since I have pretty played SPCAMO stuff since 2003 and have over 300 PBEM posted over at the blitz. Of which, only about 20 are non SPCAMO battles.As I see you only have a couple of posts on SZO I hope you will share some of that SPMBT knowledge here. SPWAW has been the primary focus here BUT I see that changing if WinSPMBT is easier for the masses to get up and running than SPMBT (DOS).

[dita]

Pyros, I seen the result yesterday of the Eurovision, and I thought of you and our country and your Euro cup win. Strange how things turn out sometimes :)

[Skotty702]

As I see you only have a couple of posts on SZO I hope you will share some of that SPMBT knowledge here. SPWAW has been the primary focus here BUT I see that changing if WinSPMBT is easier for the masses to get up and running than SPMBT (DOS).

Thanks for considering me a credible source of tid bits for SPCAMO stuff.

The easiest thing I suggest for you to do is go over to the Blitz web forum and run a search on my screen name, "Skotty702" I put a couple of lenghtly posts about OP fire tactics and Helo tactics.

I am too impeaded by these damn chills to type any more, so you'll have to wade through the posts. I think you will get something out of them. Be advised, AG/DG will tweak more code under the hood than they tell the players so things may change a bit in the new release. However, the two issues I stated will most likely stay intact cuz they are realistic.

Cheers
Scott

[Double Deuce]

Be advised, AG/DG will tweak more code under the hood than they tell the players so things may change a bit in the new release.I knd of get that feeling from the Yahoo boards. I am sure they read and take suggestions into account BUT by responding or giving their views there they would only open themselves up to unlimited debate/argument. While it is frustrating to us on the outside it probably allows them to design the game without unecessary interruption or delay. Truth be told, they have done an excellent job with both SPMBT and SPWW2 so far so I'm not gonna rock that boat. :)

[Skotty702]

I knd of get that feeling from the Yahoo boards. I am sure they read and take suggestions into account BUT by responding or giving their views there they would only open themselves up to unlimited debate/argument. While it is frustrating to us on the outside it probably allows them to design the game without unecessary interruption or delay. Truth be told, they have done an excellent job with both SPMBT and SPWW2 so far so I'm not gonna rock that boat. :)

I understand perefectly understand you point. However, they do know who I am, for I have done a lot of sound effect work for them and I have made the releases since v2. I even helped DG with cleaning up the background battle loop. I know they don't respond to direct outside emails about game issues. Sometimes AG AKA mobhack, will respond to some "safe" questions on the group. So I know he's sees them but doesn't not reply He could easily email off fourum and they know I keep my mouth shut. I think it's plain rude IMO.

I'm just trying to make the game better, and some issues are just mechanical, like viewin the crew in vehicles.

Cheers
Scott

[Achilles]

I think it's plain rude IMO.

I'm just trying to make the game better, and some issues are just mechanical, like viewin the crew in vehicles.

Cheers
Scott

Dear Scott,

Take my word that Don & Andy are very nice persons, but for every "BUT" there is always a reason. Sometimes this reason is obvious and we may see it, BUT sometimes there are reasons beyond our comprehension. There is more than black and white,... remember me... :smoke:

cheers,
Pyros

[Skirmisher]

I think those are the two main factors that DD has mentioned. Recon by using loads of trucks etc is one of the major problems. Can`t see how it could be progammed in to avoid this issue though

Do you mean when the computer buys or against real players?

[Pannonicus]

I think they usually take into account our inputs, even if they dont say so. I supplied information on Hungarian OOB for SPMBT, most of the things I suggested appeared in the next edition. Lets see with WinSPMBT...

For trucks, I dont think anything can be done regarding humans, except making them more expensive - with has its disadvantages; or adopt a new code, allowing "selective" opfire, either controlled by player (I hated it in SPWaW, however), or by making possible to distinguish between soft and hard targets, omitting soft ones. I am not sure the code could be twisted like this.

For computer, it seems easier, we just have to give the preference/rarity order that trucks can be loaded only with infantry, no single trucks allowed.

Otherwise, until recently, trucks (KrAZ) were used to recon spots in advance for SP-SAM (Kub) batteries in HDF. Now they changed this recon element to BTR-80. So recon by truck has some validity, even if it is not the soundest tactics.

[Aries]

SPWaW has Panzer Leo's very nice H2H mod. Made with playing humans in mind.
The game can only be made better with very impressive online player to player improvements.

I find in Battle mode, the game often completely falls on its face thanks to unimaginative AI actions. I rarely if ever play the Battle style also, because "buying" a force is often like a shopping trip, and not like depicting the real world.

I have also often found the extreme templated manner that surrounds placement of VH locations to be a major burden in all but scenarios.

Steel Panthers still lives thanks to how easy it can be for some of our brighter fans to make custom scenarios.
I generally only play scenarios or campaigns.

[Skotty702]

I have also often found the extreme templated manner that surrounds placement of VH locations to be a major burden in all but scenarios.
[/QUOTE]

You may know this already, but in the current releases of the SPCAMO versions you can do massive map and VH editing from the player 1 "view map" screen in the purchase menu. It's awesome for PBEM and actually makes play against the AI in long/generated campaign mode a bit more engaging. Still against the AI of course.

Cheers
Scott

[Double Deuce]

You may know this already, but in the current releases of the SPCAMO versions you can do massive map and VH editing from the player 1 "view map" screen in the purchase menu. This is one of the excellent features of SPMBT/SPWW2. One click of a button creates a new radom map. Just click until you see something you like. :)

[dita]

Do you mean when the computer buys or against real players?

I mean against real people. haven`t really seen much of it myself, but against a real person I don`t know how they can stop it like Pannonicus said. I could be wrong but the rarity issue doesn`t effect trucks much, something else would need to be done to get around this in a human vs human game

[Warhero]

Hmm how about ability to play MBT/WW2 from south to north and vice versa ;) ? Some option which player could choose ("advance/attack direction" or something like that) in battle/campaign generator?

And how about ability to choose 2 different nations against you into 1 battle? On other words, think about for example, you choose Israel and 2 arab nations (Egypt and Syria) for AI?

Any comments about these?

Warhero

[Pannonicus]

Most of these mods would be fine - north-south is useless, however, north-east would be interesting, as forces would not oppose each other, but would flank.

[Achilles]

Some very good points by everyone... :)

Some of these will be included in the game (already were ;) ), some others will not make it to this release.

cheers

[Warhero]

Maybe that "north-south" direction is not everybody's cup of tea, but somebody (like me ;) ) would like to use that option even sometimes in MBT/WW2... Think about "big battle" 200X160 (maybe larger in next version?) hex maps? These could work as "air cavalry battles" quite well. Think about some Vietnam-style battle or why not some "riverine battle" going up/down with patrol boats along some river ;)... And you know that enemy is somewhere there...

One thing which I don't like (especially in SPWAW) is that I can see "frontline flags (those who separate my and enemy's sides)" before 1st turn. It's bit boring to know that "ok, let's give artillery/air strike about 10 hexes area from those frontline flags once again" :whist: . And wipe about half (if not all) enemy forces away even not to begin 1st turn... Especially with small maps this "temptation-to-use-all-artillery-what-you-have" comes often into my mind. I could understand some flags which show me where do I move my troops before beginning of turn 1. Any comments? Anyone agree?

[Secret Agent]

Think about some Vietnam-style battle or why not some "riverine battle" going up/down with patrol boats along some river ;)... And you know that enemy is somewhere there...


Would it include a 'John Kerry' unit? :D :hush:

[Double Deuce]

One thing which I don't like (especially in SPWAW) is that I can see "frontline flags (those who separate my and enemy's sides)" before 1st turn. It's bit boring to know that "ok, let's give artillery/air strike about 10 hexes area from those frontline flags once again" :whist: . And wipe about half (if not all) enemy forces away even not to begin 1st turn... Yes but that is a real life tactic anyway if the spare shells are available. But how effective would this be against a player who anticipates having this type of maneuver put on him? I myself never (as long as there is room) place units directly behind hills or obvious nice deploy areas. Against a skilled opponent I would just be asking for trouble and was a lesson I learned the hard way in my newbie years. It's never fun to start a battle with half your troops blown away. :cry:

[Warhero]

Heh maybe something like that;)... And VC fires from bush ;) ...
(A little wordgame) :laugh:

[Double Deuce]

Heh maybe something like that;)... And VC fires from bush ;) ...
(A little wordgame) :laugh:Would that be "Old" or "New" Bush? :whist:

[Secret Agent]

:laugh:

If WinSPMBT did include those patrol boats, soon they would add submarines.....then frigates....destroyers...cruisers....and finally, aircraft carriers! Of course, they would have to change the name. ;)

[J. Dhatori]

I for one would love to see updated OOB's and Columbia, Venezuela and EU (to simulate the rapid deployment troops) as nations.

[Warhero]

Hmm has anyone here mentioned "reinforcements" yet? So, how about ability call reinforcements (like in SPWAW) during battle/campaign? And it would be even better if player could decide where (I mean which hex on the map he/she wants them) :p . What do you think about this?

[dita]

Thats a good idea. Ability to call reinforcesment would be a nice touch.

[Warhero]

And how about ability to use SPWW2/SPMBT's maps in those Windows versions? Maybe some "tool" how to convert SPWAW's maps into WinSPMBT/WW2?

[Warhero]

Heh one thing came into mind too ;) ... Think about seeing whole fighter/bomber squadron firing/bombing :p ... Let's say 3-5 plane squadron on the map. Heh B-52 squadrons would be cool with some Vietnam maps :p . Even better if we could see each plane dropping some napalm/other bombs... Well, I think that we could only dream about this (very difficult to code I suppose?) but if sometimes Camo guys will find way to make it real ;) ...

Second thing:ability for air/sea battles :crosseye: . THAT could ownz :surprise:... Anyone agree?

[J. Dhatori]

Hmmm, cruise missiles? Is that even feasible? I'm also thinking about the german kamikaze-UAV.

[Warhero]

Hmm has anyone mentioned yet ability to choose summer/winter camo colours? And ability choose summer/winter/jungle/desert terrain in map generator (I mean for generated map)? For example you choose German vs Brits, time December, year you name it ;) and default map is wooden/snowy Middle Europe style map. With some option you could choose some jungle/desert style terrain into same map (some kind of button switch, one push "Europe" , second push "Jungle", third "Desert" and so on)... Now you must load pre-made map in battle generator. Is this possible to do?

[junk2drive]

Looks like we are in for a delayed release.
Read the posts at Yahoo groups.
I was hoping for this weekend as it is USA Memorial Day, Monday is a holiday.

[Double Deuce]

Looks like we are in for a delayed release.
Read the posts at Yahoo groups.Yeah, I saw that too. Been following the posts to see how it develops. :cry:

[dita]

just been reading the posts over at yahoo :cry:

Its a real shame that it is been delayed, particularly for this sort of reason.

[Boonierat]

Could someone make like a summary of these posts here? :cheeky:

[Warhero]

And how about editing map just before 1st turn? I mean, adding bridge over large river, removing trees/houses from some particular hex? Not generating whole map area every time (as happens now), just here and there (when it's needed of course)...

[tinjaw]

Could someone make like a summary of these posts here? :cheeky:Someone violated their NDA. Until that person confesses, the game is on hold.

[MajorH]

Someone violated their NDA. Until that person confesses, the game is on hold.

Are you kidding?

[Warhero]

Excuse me but what means "NDA"? Could anyone explain? And what is it's meaning in this case?

[Boonierat]

Excuse me but what means "NDA"? Could anyone explain? And what is it's meaning in this case?

Non-Disclosure Agreement I guess :confused:

[Double Deuce]

Are you kidding?Unfortunately not. :cry:

[Warhero]

So if I understood right, someone has talked us "too much too early" about coming WinSPMBT, right? Of course it could mean something else too :cry: ... Hopefully not very serious that could delay it forever :nervous: ...

[Achilles]

I don't know if you use the term of "collective responsability",
but this is what happened.
One person did something that was wrong, critical information about the game leaked out and this has resulted to severe consequences for a lot of people.

[MajorH]

Why do the developers even care about NDAs given that this is a non profit project? Or has that changed?

If they dawdle for too long I might opt to release the WWII version of TacOps. :)

[Wodin]

Hmm......

Does that mean someone has been shooting their mouth off?

I havent seen anything..

It wasnt you Achillies was it :whist: :laugh:

So if no one owns up then the game will never be released?

[Double Deuce]

Does that mean someone has been shooting their mouth off?Basically yes!

I havent seen anything..It wasn't what was said here, it happened on the official SPMBT Yahoo forum. A playtester supposedly told a buddy about some new features and the buddy in his excitement posted on the Yahoo Forums how he was looking forward to the leaked changes.

[Double Deuce]

If they dawdle for too long I might opt to release the WWII version of TacOps. :)You should do that anyway! But of course not before its ready. :D

[Double Deuce]

Excuse me but what means "NDA"? Could anyone explain? And what is it's meaning in this case?Boonierat is correct. It is a Non-Disclosure Agreement. In basic english it is a confidentiality agreement.

[Warhero]

Hmm how many members that Yahoo's WinMBT mailing list has? Okay, I understand that damage is done, but how it affects into free game? What it means that only x amount of potential players will get some info about new features and we others (who are not that list members) not at all? Why to worry about "NDA damage" so much? I'm not going to say that "agreements are made for break them" but this is not commercial/business case ok? Or has anybody's copyright things been hurt so badly that game will not release? Do we have to wait until end of world because this?

Just my 2 cents...

Warhero

[Achilles]

Hmm......

Does that mean someone has been shooting their mouth off?

I havent seen anything..

It wasnt you Achillies was it :whist: :laugh:
:mad: Actually you won't see here anything like this, and even if someone attempts to import (copy/paste) such information in these boards, I would ask from DD to delete this kind of information immediately.


So if no one owns up then the game will never be released?
Rest asure that whatever small delay of the release of the game is ONLY connected with additional UPGRADES and last moment FIXES.
A lot of good people are working hard to give you the best SP game ever created.

[Warhero]

Btw, Achilles, how many members are in SP Camo dev team? Just curious to know ;) ...

And how do you got the code from SSI (I suppose it was owner/dev of original SP games)? Is it secret or can you tell about it?

Warhero

[Achilles]

Hi,

I am sorry but I can't answer your question.
If you wish to find answers you should seek them by asking directly those people at the SPMBT yahoo group:

Don Goodbrand, Andy Gailey Producers/Programmers

cheers

[dita]

:mad: .......Actually you won't see here anything like this, and even if someone attempts to import (copy/paste) such information in these boards, I would ask from DD to delete this kind of information immediately.........


I`m glad in my excitment of reading the "leaked" news over at the yahoo group I didn`t post it here. A voice inside told me that it would be not the right thing to do :halo:

[Double Deuce]

Okay, I understand that damage is done, but how it affects into free game? What it means that only x amount of potential players will get some info about new features and we others (who are not that list members) not at all? Why to worry about "NDA damage" so much? I'm not going to say that "agreements are made for break them" but this is not commercial/business case ok? Or has anybody's copyright things been hurt so badly that game will not release? You have to look at the big picture. SP CAMO is affiliated with Shrapnel Games who does build games for profit. They use (if I understand correctly) the same NDA so in essence a violation of this agreement by a CAMO playtester reflects on the trust between CAMO and Shrapnel. Some say they may have come down too hard BUT IMHO, its easier to crack the whip, investigate and then re-evaluate things.

[Double Deuce]

:mad: Actually you won't see here anything like this, and even if someone attempts to import (copy/paste) such information in these boards, I would ask from DD to delete this kind of information immediately.Which I would not hesitate to do. There will be plenty of opportunity to comment on the game after its release. I plan to cover the game pretty throroughly here at SZO and I am sure other sites will support it as well. I'm looking forward to the new features (whatever they are) even though I think the game is adequate as it is except fpr the DOS base. Anything added to the engine over this is just icing on the cake.

[dita]

Which I would not hesitate to do. There will be plenty of opportunity to comment on the game after its release. I plan to cover the game pretty throroughly here at SZO and I am sure other sites will support it as well. I'm looking forward to the new features (whatever they are) even though I think the game is adequate as it is except fpr the DOS base. Anything added to the engine over this is just icing on the cake.

I couldn`t agree with you more. I look forward to the release and the extended coverage that will no doubt be generated when the game crosses over to full windows, which, like you said, is the main plus for most people, anything else is a juicy bonus :)

[junk2drive]

I still find it amazing that almost ten years later there is still all this excitement, worry, stress, etc.
Most games are tossed after a couple of years.
I hope it is still free and we are not disappointed.

[Warhero]

Same here :) . SP Camo has always done great job since 1st version of SPMBT/WW2 and I'm sure that newest version will be The Best SP Game ever :p . Can't wait to play it :p ...

[Double Deuce]

Same here :) . SP Camo has always done great job since 1st version of SPMBT/WW2 and I'm sure that newest version will be The Best SP Game ever :p . Can't wait to play it :p ...While I don't agree with all their super secrecy, you can't argue with the results. However they are running the show, I gotta admit, it works. :)

[Warhero]

Hmm how about night visions (like DG for example)? And different phases of day (from morning to midnight) during battle/campaign shown by some way? Is it possible to do or not?



Btw, are Matrix and SP Camo Workshop only 2 groups/firms who develop SP games "forward"? Does anyone know others? Even OOB "dev groups"? I have never heard about others...

[Skirmisher]

[/QUOTE]Btw, are Matrix and SP Camo Workshop only 2 groups/firms who develop SP games "forward"? Does anyone know others? Even OOB "dev groups"? I have never heard about others...[/QUOTE]


Matrix got the Steel Panthers III code, CAMO got the Steel Panthers II code. No others exsist.

[Wodin]

:mad: Actually you won't see here anything like this, and even if someone attempts to import (copy/paste) such information in these boards, I would ask from DD to delete this kind of information immediately.



Rest asure that whatever small delay of the release of the game is ONLY connected with additional UPGRADES and last moment FIXES.
A lot of good people are working hard to give you the best SP game ever created.


Hey I was only kidding.

SPWW2 is the game Im really interested in.

Can I ask a question?

Has it had a major graphical facelift?

[Willy]

Even OOB "dev groups"?

Actually at Spwaw.com there is work in progress towards a OOB mod for Spwaw ;)

[Skirmisher]

Actually at Spwaw.com there is work in progress towards a OOB mod for Spwaw ;)


I dont personaly consider mod groups game developers.They take the coding that somebody else has done and modify it,thats why I said theres only two groups.They are the only one's authorized to rework the code.


As for Win SPMBT,it seems to be in a woeful situation right now.
Some canary leeked info violating a written agreement and the coders are darn pissed off about it. This could delay things for some time,especially since the "canary" doesn't seem to want to be identified. I wish this person would stand up and take responsibility for his/her foolish actions . :mad:

[Warhero]

Maybe this is only speculation but is it any way possible to release WinSPMBT under new name and negotiate with some other firms (Wargamer, Matrix, somebody else?) about giving server "space" for d/l? In case that Shrapnel Games will not let Camo group to
use their server (due to leaking)?

Just guessing :rolleyes: ...

Warhero

[Aries]

I been out of the home over the weekend. I guess some doorknob has said things that should not have been said eh.

I hope this doesn't in some way burden the SP Camo guys unduly.

[jrotc_soldier89]

I really need to play a game, email me to let me know whats going on, lilzshorty89@yahoo.com :)

[Achilles]

Rest asure that whatever small delay of the release of the game is ONLY connected with additional UPGRADES and last moment FIXES.
A lot of good people are working hard to give you the best SP game ever created.

I never thought that I would need to quote my own post...

Guys, the game due to the "leak" problem has suffered a delay of max 2 days...
At the moment the whole team of SPCAMO is working focused on the project.

It would be best if we continued to speak about the game itself and not about its backstage. :)

cheers,

[Skirmisher]

I never thought that I would need to quote my own post...

Guys, the game due to the "leak" problem has suffered a delay of max 2 days...
At the moment the whole team of SPCAMO is working focused on the project.

It would be best if we continued to speak about the game itself and not about its backstage. :)

cheers,


Thats really good to hear Achilles. I have to admit I was worried.

[Double Deuce]

I never thought that I would need to quote my own post...Well, we do try to keep new and exciting around here. :p

It would be best if we continued to speak about the game itself and not about its backstage. :) I second that recommendation!

Back to the original topic of this thread....

What features do you think the new version will include (I said think, not what was leaked)? :whist:

[Warhero]

What do you think about my previous "night vision idea" message? And that map editing thing? Any sense at all?

[Achilles]

What do you think about my previous "night vision idea" message? And that map editing thing? Any sense at all?

Hi,

I can only tell you my personal opinion about your ideas.

If by night vision you refer to the ability to see with the use of infra then I think this already exist in SPMBT (it is simulated by the vision factor 20/40)

If by night vision you refer to night conditions then this is simply a question of low visibility.

If by night vision you simply mean the idea of a variable (diminishing) visibility through the duration of the game, then I like this idea and I second it.

As for the map editing issue you can always save a random map then edit this map in the editor and load it as a custom one.
Probably, what you wish, is to have access directly from the genarated map screen to the map edit options; IMO this not a bad idea. :)

cheers

[Warhero]

If by night vision you simply mean the idea of a variable (diminishing) visibility through the duration of the game, then I like this idea and I second it.

Yes I meant that ;) .

Probably, what you wish, is to have access directly from the genarated map screen to the map edit options; IMO this not a bad idea. :)

Hopefully not at all :laugh: ...

Warhero

[Warhero]

And one addition to that, ability to add more "objects" (let's say building into needed hex, add some railroad from hex x to y). And all this in battle generator's map edit window :p ... No "unnecessary" saving-map-before-battle-actions. Any possibilities to make it real?

Warhero

[Achilles]

And one addition to that, ability to add more "objects" (let's say building into needed hex, add some railroad from hex x to y). And all this in battle generator's map edit window :p ... No "unnecessary" saving-map-before-battle-actions. Any possibilities to make it real?

Warhero
I am sorry but I can't answer you in this question. :)

[Alby]

Can you tell us if units will still fire smoke on their own...I never liked that "feature"
Alby

[Achilles]

Can you tell us if units will still fire smoke on their own...I never liked that "feature"
Alby

Dear Alby,

Why don't you like it? :surprise: ,

It is for your own protection ! :laugh:

[Alby]

becuase units sometimes fired smoke when I didnt want them too!
LOL :laugh:

[Warhero]

Achilles, I'm just guessing :rolleyes: ... As title of this topic says ok? I'm not (as anyone here I suppose?) trying to make you to tell us more as you are allowed to tell right? My comments (as always) are made purely to keep this topic alive :laugh: . Everybody can comment them if they want ok? For example my "night vision" message was made for common discussion, not to asking to reveal is it there or not ok?

I'm the last human on this damn planet who would like to hurt progress of "The Best SP Games ever" any way :halo: !

Warhero

[Achilles]

becuase units sometimes fired smoke when I didnt want them too!
LOL :laugh:

Thanks GOD they did it, so they stayed alive !!! :laugh:

[Achilles]

Achilles, I'm just guessing :rolleyes: ... As title of this topic says ok? I'm not (as anyone here I suppose?) trying to make you to tell us more as you are allowed to tell right? My comments (as always) are made purely to keep this topic alive :laugh: . Everybody can comment them if they want ok? For example my "night vision" message was made for common discussion, not to asking to reveal is it there or not ok?

I'm the last human on this damn planet who would like to hurt progress of "The Best SP Games ever" any way :halo: !

Warhero

Warhero,

Feedback is always welcomed !!! :)

But keep in mind that any modification to the game code could mean additional time and effort from the programmers with the risk of several unwanted side-effects (on other aspects of the game).

I thing that DG and AG know better than all of us what is best for the game at this phase of the project.

cheers :)

[Double Deuce]

For example my "night vision" message was made for common discussion, not to asking to reveal is it there or not ok?SPMBT does not have a night setting like in SPWAW. In SPWAW you can set the Dawn, Dusk, No Moon, Full Moon, etc and also the weather. In SPMBT (at least the old one, you can only adjust the visibility ranges to simulate weather or lighting limitations on visibility. I think it had to do with the limitations of the base game engines used for these 2 games (SP2 vs SP3). Just guessing though.

[Boonierat]

I say release the game now and patch it later! :cheeky: there's always a patch anyway ;)

[Double Deuce]

I say release the game now and patch it later! :cheeky: there's always a patch anyway ;)Exactly. Lets get it out and see what it can and can't do, then work up a wish list to send to CAMO for consideration of future releases/patches. Many of the options we have mentioned here or might like to see included could already be in there, BUT since there is complete radio silence from CAMO we won't know till we load it up and dig in. :D

[Warhero]

Thanks Achilles to understanding my point :) . I understand that all these things what I have said here were not to be "last-time-wishlist-to-add-just-before-release" but maybe into future versions... But it's only in SP Camo group's own hands what they will add into them, isn't it? We can't endlessly demand them to add new features (some ideas can be done, some are "senseless" what comes to playability).

I just wish (as many others here I suppose?) that our ideas will not delay release of WinMBT any longer, right? If there are not bigger bugs, I'm happy :laugh:... Patches can be always done afterwards, aren't they?

Warhero

[Warhero]

A little thinking joke :p :
Think about 3D-graphics in Windows version (same style as Combat Mission :p )... Heh I think it will never happens in SP-environment :rolleyes: ...

Warhero

[Achilles]

Hi,

At this moment I don't have the clearance to say anything concerning release details, but if you carefully read the last announcement that Don G. has made in the Yahoo board you will find more info about where to look... :censored:

The only thing that I could say for the moment,
is something "poetic"

"...This is like the serenity before the storm..."

cheers :)

[Warhero]

Achilles, could you copy/paste that announce into here please? Or do we (who are not members of Yahoo's list) have to join into that mailing list only for someone's announce :rolleyes: ? If there is no other choice, I must join into there ok?

Warhero

[junk2drive]

Keep an eye on Schrapnel's forums. ;)

[Warhero]

Keep an eye on Schrapnel's forums. ;)

Eh where there? Too many forums there :rolleyes: ...

[junk2drive]

My q and Don's a

"In SPMBT@yahoogroups.com, "junk2drive" <junk2drive@h...> wrote:
> Will there be a separate Yahoo group for WinSPMBT and WinSPWW2?
> If so, can we join now?


There will be a WinSPMBT group at Shrapnel games that will be come
active when the game is released

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/ubbthreads.php

You can join that one when it activates and Andy and I and others will
be there to answer questions or help you with the game.

We will not be starting or supporting a Yahoo based list for WinSPMBT
and we won't be offering any further support for the DOS based MBT
when WinSPMBT is released.

Don Goodbrand "

[mr_clark]

Yep, the mesasageboard makes me feel there'll be something coming soon....

[Warhero]

Hmm I just recently joined into SPMBT mailing list (not verification came yet)... Do I understand right that my account is will be "unnecessary" after WinMBT's release and SPMBT's mailing list will be stopped? Is this true? Do I have to ask admin (whoever he is) to remove me from there or not?

Warhero

[Double Deuce]

Hmm I just recently joined into SPMBT mailing list (not verification came yet)... Do I understand right that my account is will be "unnecessary" after WinMBT's release and SPMBT's mailing list will be stopped? Is this true? Yes, that is the rumor going round BUT I would think it may remain active for supporting the DOS version. The game itself will not be supported but the Yahoo group might still be available for people to discuss the game.
Do I have to ask admin (whoever he is) to remove me from there or not?You can remove yourself from the list. Go into "My Group" and edit your membership. I believe it is named the "Leave this Group? link".

[Aries]

For any that have not made the choice to join the Shrapnel forums, they are well run (my opinion).

They have solid no nonsense expectations from their membership, and I admire them for that.

[junk2drive]

I went ahead and joined the forum in anticipation. No news yet.

[Warhero]

Achilles, how long Don, Andy and guys of SP Camo group will torture us with looong-time waiting :laugh: ?

Who's unpatient here ;) ? Me :whist: ? No, no at all :p ...

*wipes drooling away and bites nails upatiently* :cheeky:

Warhero

[Double Deuce]

Could someone make like a summary of these posts here? :cheeky:I have started another thread for that here. (http://www.strategyzoneonline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=28236)

Please feel free to add your ideas to the list.

[Achilles]

Hello Gentlemen,

Although I can feel your agony... I am not authorised to enlight you about a release date.

My impression is that soon you will read official announcements.

best,

[Warhero]

Heh I just discovered new meaning into english word "soon" :laugh: ...

Soon=not so soon as you first thought ;). It's timeline from now to eternity :laugh: ...

Me impatient? What? Who claim so :whist: ?

Warhero

[Achilles]

Come on guys, you are near the end...(of your torture :laugh: ), hold on for a few more days!

Meanwhile you may enjoy playing the scenarios provided by DD or you could watch a VCR/DVD war-movie.

One thing that will be great is that with the new WinSPMBT version of the game a lot of people will get involved with scenario/campaign designing.

I know that some of you have participated in campaign designing in several projects.

BTW, how many of you would like to get involved with a big campaign project (could be a Vietnam theme for example)? ;)


cheers :smoke:

[Double Deuce]

p.s If you knew how many times I had started to write a post and then (at the end) I had hit the delete button you would be impressed...Hmmm, I wonder which is worse? Not knowing anything and waiting for the release or knowing alot and not being able to say? :nuts:

[Boonierat]

Hmmm, I wonder which is worse? Not knowing anything and waiting for the release or knowing alot and not being able to say? :nuts:

Well DD, I'm afraid Achilles already HAS the game installed on his comp....let's hack it! :cheeky:

[Achilles]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Achilles
p.s If you knew how many times I had started to write a post and then (at the end) I had hit the delete button you would be impressed...

Hmmm, I wonder which is worse? Not knowing anything and waiting for the release or knowing alot and not being able to say? :nuts:

If you check my original post even this quote was deleted... LOL :laugh:

[Achilles]

Come on guys, you are near the end...(of your torture :laugh: ), hold on for a few more days!

Meanwhile you may enjoy playing the scenarios provided by DD or you could watch a VCR/DVD war-movie.

One thing that will be great is that with the new WinSPMBT version of the game a lot of people will get involved with scenario/campaign designing.

I know that some of you have participated in campaign designing in several projects.

BTW, how many of you would like to get involved with a big campaign project (could be a Vietnam theme for example)? ;)


cheers :smoke:

Ok, let's focus on the above :D

[Double Deuce]

Ok, let's focus on the above :DHey, quit trying to change the subject, we're still venting here! :p.

I do think it will be hard for many to commit until they see the changes. Depending on changes to the editor and stuff there may be a very high learning curve or re-learning a completely new system.

[junk2drive]

Come on guys, you are near the end...(of your torture :laugh: ), hold on for a few more days!

Meanwhile you may enjoy playing the scenarios provided by DD or you could watch a VCR/DVD war-movie.

One thing that will be great is that with the new WinSPMBT version of the game a lot of people will get involved with scenario/campaign designing.

I know that some of you have participated in campaign designing in several projects.

BTW, how many of you would like to get involved with a big campaign project (could be a Vietnam theme for example)? ;)


cheers :smoke:

Maybe. I don't have a lot of experience with SPMBT or SPWW2. I did play a lot of SPWAW a while ago.
I have done a few Vietnam battles for CMAK.

[Achilles]

Hey, quit trying to change the subject, we're still venting here! :p.

I do think it will be hard for many to commit until they see the changes. Depending on changes to the editor and stuff there may be a very high learning curve or re-learning a completely new system.

Don't worry DD,

everything is fine :)

[Double Deuce]

BTW, how many of you would like to get involved with a big campaign project (could be a Vietnam theme for example)? ;)OK, lets think about what would be needed for a project like this!


Map designer's,
Historical OOB researchers,
Briefing/scenario text writers,
Playtesters.
What else?

[Achilles]

...Tacticians (!) :laugh:

campaign scenario...

Decision over "fixed core force" or "open core force" , historical or fictional missions, etc...

cheers

[Boonierat]

Hey, I could help with a Vietnam campaign :cheeky: got pretty good sources for OOBs and Maps, was already thinking about the possibilities of doing one on my own about the 173d Airborne Brigade Dak To campaign when WinSPMBT will be released

[Achilles]

So,

I already count 4 brave volunteers! :devil:

[junk2drive]

Dang you DD
I just went to the Yahoo group last post and all I saw was
SPMBT...available

I think Achilles "just a few days" is worse torture than checking Yahoo and SPCAMO and Schrapnel websites all day long.

[Double Deuce]

Decision over "fixed core force" or "open core force" , historical or fictional missions, etc...I prefer using the "Fixed Core" force so the designers can better personalize the unit and give it a personality. And then have them perform fictional missions within the context of a larger historical operation.

[Aries]

We still pondering the many neat what ifs here?

Hmm what if the game were to shut down after one hour.

Just auto save and turn off.

So that in the event the gamer was getting to obsessed, they could be assisted to get up and take a break :) Maybe go out and do that chore the wife was nagging about hehe.

[dita]

OK, lets think about what would be needed for a project like this!


Map designer's,
Historical OOB researchers,
Briefing/scenario text writers,
Playtesters.
What else?

Count me in. I would be interested in helping out a combined effort to develop a campaign. Not sure what I could contribute, but I`d like to help!

[Achilles]

Welcome on board, Paul :)

[Double Deuce]

What size unit should player command? Should it be a platoon, company, battalion?

I'm partial to a company, that way the scenarios can be either small or large based on how many support units etc are added for the particular mission.

[RedMike]

I like Company level.

[Achilles]

Once the game is released I will arrange a kick-off meeting and we are going to discuss these issues in the "proper" secrecy!!! :smoke:

Anyway it will be great if everyone prepares a pre-plan with what he would like to see and how this could fit in a BIG campaign.

I have in mind to use some "revolutionary" campaign concepts that will give the project a more "campaign" blend. :devious:

The best part of this project will be the knowledge that every participant will gather from the overall experience.

We will make sure that everybody has the chance to learn all the stages of the work in order to become an adept scenario/campaign designer. :)

[Pannonicus]

I like battalion sized ones. Regiment/brigade is usually too big, in fact it almost always breaks down into many smaller battles.

[Pannonicus]

I would help with design - OOB design would be my favourite task.

[Achilles]

I would help with design - OOB design would be my favourite task.

Thanks :)

[Achilles]

Ok gentlemen,

we are almost there,

I wish that all the persons who have shown interest to participate in a Vietnam campaign project to send me an email to pyros@myway.com , I need from them a valid email account and if they wish they may add their comments/views (concerning their abilities, ideas etc...).

thanks,

[Pannonicus]

Msg. sent to you!

[junk2drive]

email sent.